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    Best privacy chat apps

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    • d19dotca
      d19dotca @marcusquinn last edited by

      @marcusquinn Yeah Signal's UI is crap, but it's supposedly one of the "best" for privacy, so I hear. Been using it with a few friends for a couple of years and it's worked well. Just not a fan of the interface.

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      • H
        humptydumpty @d19dotca last edited by

        @d19dotca My problem with Signal and most other apps is that you need a phone number or email address associated with the account which can be mined from the metadata.

        Signal removed the "from" in the metadata but for an app that touts "secure communications", you'd think they would have done that since the app's inception.

        You might say, "I don't have anything to hide" or "I don't care if they know some things about me" but all this info is being collected and they're building a profile about you so they can profit from it. That's the best case scenario. Now imagine dictators having that kind of power in their hands. What's stopping corporations, governments, organizations from abusing this power? Nada. We have to protect ourselves by denying them every bit of data no matter of irrelevant it may seem. Ask yourself, if it's that irrelevant, why do they want it so bad? Why does big brother want a backdoor into encryption?

        I rest my case.

        d19dotca 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 5
        • marcusquinn
          marcusquinn last edited by marcusquinn

          Privacy is my new favourite subject, to the point I'm writing blog posts as I learn more, this being the first I got around to:

          • https://www.marcusquinn.com/do-you-trust-this-computer/
          1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 1
          • marcusquinn
            marcusquinn @mehdi last edited by

            @mehdi Damn, fooled me, and I thought I was good at spotting the cracks but information-overload is a great marketing tool eh. Any other recommendations then?

            jdaviescoates mehdi 2 Replies Last reply Reply Quote 0
            • jdaviescoates
              jdaviescoates @marcusquinn last edited by

              @marcusquinn I think Signal has the best privacy and security. But yeah, I've never used the desktop app, just the mobile app.

              1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
              • mehdi
                mehdi App Dev @marcusquinn last edited by

                @marcusquinn From a security and privacy standpoint, I would only consider Signal and Matrix. Both are pretty usable in my opinion.

                I also heard good things, from a security perspective, about Olvid. No idea how good is the interface though.

                jdaviescoates rmdes 2 Replies Last reply Reply Quote 4
                • jdaviescoates
                  jdaviescoates @mehdi last edited by jdaviescoates

                  @mehdi said in Best privacy chat apps:

                  Olvid

                  Hadn't heard of that before, sounds good:
                  https://www.olvid.io/en/

                  I note it doesn't have the phone number/ email address issue Signal and other apps have that @humptydumpty mentions above.

                  I also note that Olvid isn't (yet) open source:
                  https://olvid.io/faq/is-olvid-code-open-source/

                  But the technology it's powered by is:
                  https://olvid.io/faq/is-olvid-technology-open-source/

                  robi 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 1
                  • robi
                    robi @jdaviescoates last edited by

                    @jdaviescoates it seems they are limiting voice calls with a subscription.

                    1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                    • rmdes
                      rmdes @mehdi last edited by

                      @mehdi what do you think of Wire compared to Telegram ?

                      mehdi 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 1
                      • mehdi
                        mehdi App Dev @rmdes last edited by

                        @rmdes End-to-End encryption, not re-implementing their own crypto primitives, using a well known protocol, open-source ... On first glance, looks good.

                        rmdes 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 1
                        • rmdes
                          rmdes @mehdi last edited by

                          @mehdi I Also like that it allow people to get in touch and use the entire feature set without ever exchanging phone numbers

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                          • M
                            murgero App Dev last edited by

                            Matrix + Element is probably the best privacy focused app if I am being honest. Next is XMPP (With OMEMO or PGP).

                            Client side, each have multiple apps for Windows, Linux, Mac, iOS, and Android (Not to even mention Web Apps).

                            Matrix is probably the best option of the two as by default it can federate with other servers securely.

                            1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                            • marcusquinn
                              marcusquinn last edited by

                              Thoughts on Rocket.Chat security?

                              mehdi 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                              • mehdi
                                mehdi App Dev @marcusquinn last edited by

                                @marcusquinn It's self hosted. So, on that point, better than most ^^ Otherwise, there is no special security feature, no end-to-end encryption, ...

                                marcusquinn 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 1
                                • d19dotca
                                  d19dotca @humptydumpty last edited by

                                  @humptydumpty Not sure if that was really meant to be directed at me or not 😛 haha because yeah, I agree with your points on the "I don't have anything to hide" part, that's been something I've argued for years with people and fully support that it should never be about if someone has something to hide or not.

                                  What do you prefer to use over Signal though in that case if it doesn't quite past muster for you? Always open to alternatives.

                                  marcusquinn H 2 Replies Last reply Reply Quote 0
                                  • marcusquinn
                                    marcusquinn @mehdi last edited by

                                    @mehdi Cool, thanks, the scope of this post is for all chat apps, not just CLoudron ones, but insight into the Cloudron ones is always handy.

                                    I guess the hope is to find what works best for family & friends to try and get them moving to that doesn't involve self-hosting or cost because frankly that's the benchmark from the no-so-private competition.

                                    1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 1
                                    • marcusquinn
                                      marcusquinn @d19dotca last edited by

                                      Everyone here has A LOT to hide. If you're a Sys Admin, all those keys to kingdoms you have could yield great value or damage in the wrong hands.

                                      Doesn't matter how secure we are if social-engineering can get to our stuff through our peers.

                                      Aside from that, hopefully my blog post above explains a lot of other things to think about for how all our peers devices can gather data on us no matter how secure we are personally, so it will only be a whole society movement that plugs those holes, and I'm sure many here are happy to help friends and family do that if it is the seeds for a greater migration.

                                      d19dotca 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 2
                                      • d19dotca
                                        d19dotca @marcusquinn last edited by

                                        @marcusquinn Agreed. Everyone who says they have nothing to hide doesn't quite realize the potential that can come from companies having even just basic details on you.

                                        marcusquinn H 2 Replies Last reply Reply Quote 2
                                        • marcusquinn
                                          marcusquinn @d19dotca last edited by

                                          @d19dotca The most obvious one now is censorship, since your view of the curated online world is tailored to show you what you are most likely to engage with, and we're all seeing a different view. Add to that the profiling on how influential you are, so targeting the most influential people then turns them into propaganda gophers. We're all in database tables somewhere now as a statistically significant type of some kind or another.

                                          ruihildt 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 2
                                          • ruihildt
                                            ruihildt @marcusquinn last edited by

                                            The most perverse is that if you know you're watched, then you change your behaviour instead of behaving like yourself.

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