Addon request: blob storage (s3)

[infogulch]

I agree, the weakest part of this request is that there's only one somewhat-legitimate app use case for it in Outline (silly Notea..), and it doesn't seem very efficient to build an addon for just one app. Perhaps the community can scrounge up some additional examples of useful apps whose packaging for Cloudron was complicated or thwarted by the lack of s3.

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I'm curious what you think about using Minio in gateway mode (#2 above). One apprehension that's preventing me from going all-in on using some media management apps (photos, videos, music) hosted on Cloudron is that I'm worried my server will run out of disk space; with externally-hosted object storage that problem is solved (with easy to grok pay-for-what-you-use billing). My guess is this is the reason why some apps are starting to lean towards object stores like s3.

Perhaps the best way to cut it is: v1 only supports local (disk) storage; if some proportion of users have a specific need for externally-hosted object stores then we cross that gateway bridge when we get there.

[robi]

I think gateway mode by default is best, which can then point to any local or remote S3 endpoint as needed.

Again, MultiCloudron will make this very useful.

The apps will come once the capability is available, even NextCloud in S3 only mode.

[infogulch]

Nice thanks for the Nextcloud example. I added it to the list in the OP.

Gateway mode would be wonderful but it also adds some complications, in particular if done incorrectly it could throw a spanner into the currently very clean backup/restore system which is actually my favorite Cloudron feature. With that in mind I would be happy to get a version-1 implementation that only supports the local filesystem configuration.

[robi]

@infogulch It's an additional capability, not a replacement of what already works brilliantly.

[infogulch]

I would say what works brilliantly in Cloudron is the tight, seamless integration between the different components which enables admins to not have to think about huge problems like taking backups.

[MooCloud_Matt]

@robi said in Addon request: blob storage (s3):

gateway

Yes but in that case, cloudron will have to provide support for multiple NIC, 1 Gbit's NIC can't offer good performance with remote s3 + nextcloud + fire redundancy for minio for example.

[infogulch]

@moocloud_matt I'm confused how "multiple Network Interface Card (NIC)" support is relevant here. Are you familiar with the minio gateways? They are orthogonal to networking configuration.

https://docs.min.io/docs/minio-gateway-for-s3.html

[MooCloud_Matt]

@infogulch
what I mean, is that you need more than 1 gbit's connection for 1 server, and not always 2.5/10gbits are available.
Because Minio Gateway, and Minio Backend if it's used they still pass through data, and a lot of it, especially if you have a big install of NextCloud.

We need to be able to support multiple NIC, so that we can dedicate one for Minio, or other backend file transfer without impacting the second connection that is dedicated for Apps.

[infogulch]

@moocloud_matt The number of servers that use a 1GB NIC and could saturate it because using a gateway doubles the bandwidth used to serve minio requests would probably fit on one hand if there are any at all. This concern is like a third or fourth level extrapolation, I don't think it's worth anyone's time to consider this eventuality right now.

[MooCloud_Matt]

@infogulch

for experience with CEPH, and reading how Minio works, and their requirement.

Multi NICs, are needed or highly performant one, like 2.5 at least, for decent installation with Gateway or Minio storage cluster.
https://docs.min.io/minio/vsphere/reference/production-recommendations.html

A normal NextCloud server on one single SSD, not NVMe; can saturate easily one single Gbit's NIC.

That without considering that with Minio Gateway you have to split the 1Gbits NIC in incoming S3 traffic and outgoing WebDAV traffic.
I know that NICs are duplex, but they don't perform full capacity if used to the max.

It will not be for everyone but is needed for those who use Cloudron for heavily used Server.

[infogulch]

@moocloud_matt As soon as someone comes in reporting a real case that their NIC is saturated and it's slowing down their server I'd be interested in pursuing a solution. I've never seen such a real case on these forums (though I may just be misinformed) so I'd have to tilt towards YAGNI until one appears.

Object storage is not magic, it's just data like everything else. If it's just used to serve file attachments for an app with 25 users I wouldn't expect it to be a bottleneck.