perpetual licensing
-
One-time purchase is a really bad idea and makes no sense at all .... unless the one-time purchase gets you a one-time version, e.g. version 8.5.0 and you then stick with that, no upgrades (ok, well maybe one year).
There are some precedents in financial markets, taking into account present and future value of money, for a fat payment to be made up-front for continuing lifetime service.
But generally it's a silly idea to expect to get lifetime continuing service (current version, plus free future versions) for a single fee, unless the multiple is significant, 10x or 20x.
I think the Cloudron team have got enough to do without being distracted by this kind of suggestion.
-
One-time purchase is a really bad idea and makes no sense at all .... unless the one-time purchase gets you a one-time version, e.g. version 8.5.0 and you then stick with that, no upgrades (ok, well maybe one year).
There are some precedents in financial markets, taking into account present and future value of money, for a fat payment to be made up-front for continuing lifetime service.
But generally it's a silly idea to expect to get lifetime continuing service (current version, plus free future versions) for a single fee, unless the multiple is significant, 10x or 20x.
I think the Cloudron team have got enough to do without being distracted by this kind of suggestion.
@timconsidine in that case, how is negate able to do this?
keep in mind, they cell physical appliances with PFSense plus built right into the thing .you just login to your account, and boom. yo have lifetime updates for as long as the device is active.
you get updates, and commercial software for the price of 1 appliance.
same goes with unifi dream machine pro, you get the product, it works.
for both, it seams the only subscription comes from cloud based solutions, which you can do on your own anyway.
for example, if you wanna run netgate on your own hardware (I know that's not cloud) and/or you would like to use a cloud service, you have to pay up whatever that cost is.
and cloud identity management? yeah, I don'tk now if I need that, I can do that on my own.
cloudron could make optional subscription based moddles. for example, cloud, and/or other functions that require more effect on cloudrons part. the core functionality shouldn't have to be a manual thing, just a one-time purchase.
for example, you could provide a support contract which allows for commercial support (a direct call) that is as close to immediate as it can get. we can leave forum and email alone, it's fine as it is.
if netgate and ubiquiti is not having a problem doing this, I don't think cloudron will either.remember, don't overlook security. be safe online
-
@timconsidine in that case, how is negate able to do this?
keep in mind, they cell physical appliances with PFSense plus built right into the thing .you just login to your account, and boom. yo have lifetime updates for as long as the device is active.
you get updates, and commercial software for the price of 1 appliance.
same goes with unifi dream machine pro, you get the product, it works.
for both, it seams the only subscription comes from cloud based solutions, which you can do on your own anyway.
for example, if you wanna run netgate on your own hardware (I know that's not cloud) and/or you would like to use a cloud service, you have to pay up whatever that cost is.
and cloud identity management? yeah, I don'tk now if I need that, I can do that on my own.
cloudron could make optional subscription based moddles. for example, cloud, and/or other functions that require more effect on cloudrons part. the core functionality shouldn't have to be a manual thing, just a one-time purchase.
for example, you could provide a support contract which allows for commercial support (a direct call) that is as close to immediate as it can get. we can leave forum and email alone, it's fine as it is.
if netgate and ubiquiti is not having a problem doing this, I don't think cloudron will either.@adisonverlice2 maybe you should address your questions to netgate
-
@adisonverlice2 maybe you should address your questions to netgate
@timconsidine point being, if there are companies out there that are doing this exact thing, offering the core functionality (which in cloudrons case, would be downloading applications, allowing for openid, LDAP, user management, easy updates, etc) then I don't see why cloudron wouldn't be able to do that without perpetual licensing.
IMO subscription should only come from cloud installations where work has to be done on cloudrons part.
because of course, the cloud providers are getting money a month to run cloudron instances, so I can understand cloudron wanting a piece of that pi.
but if i'm hosting on prem, I shouldn't have to pay a hundred dollars a year just to install a few applications.
keep in mind, that person is already paying for internet, electricity, and a few other things around these parts.
they don't (or sometimes, can't) pay for another subscription on top of other payments.
gotta keep the lights going somehow...remember, don't overlook security. be safe online
-
@timconsidine point being, if there are companies out there that are doing this exact thing, offering the core functionality (which in cloudrons case, would be downloading applications, allowing for openid, LDAP, user management, easy updates, etc) then I don't see why cloudron wouldn't be able to do that without perpetual licensing.
IMO subscription should only come from cloud installations where work has to be done on cloudrons part.
because of course, the cloud providers are getting money a month to run cloudron instances, so I can understand cloudron wanting a piece of that pi.
but if i'm hosting on prem, I shouldn't have to pay a hundred dollars a year just to install a few applications.
keep in mind, that person is already paying for internet, electricity, and a few other things around these parts.
they don't (or sometimes, can't) pay for another subscription on top of other payments.
gotta keep the lights going somehow...@adisonverlice2 Cloudron is much more than just a convenient way to install apps - plenty of other platforms can do that. The real value is in the automation, maintenance, and reliability it provides over time.
Ultimately, it’s a simple calculation: if the time and effort you’d spend managing updates and maintenance yourself (or with other tools) is worth less than the Cloudron license, then it’s probably not the right fit for you.
-
Comparing Cloudron with Netgate is hardly comparing like with like. The hardware appliance almost certainly has a huge markup and the software is forked from a free open source product. That is not a criticism, but essentially they have just one software product to keep updated, whereas Cloudron has many, and Cloudron is a dynamic platform not just a box hosting one app.
I understand the desire to save money but then maybe another solution would be a better choice.
-
@timconsidine point being, if there are companies out there that are doing this exact thing, offering the core functionality (which in cloudrons case, would be downloading applications, allowing for openid, LDAP, user management, easy updates, etc) then I don't see why cloudron wouldn't be able to do that without perpetual licensing.
IMO subscription should only come from cloud installations where work has to be done on cloudrons part.
because of course, the cloud providers are getting money a month to run cloudron instances, so I can understand cloudron wanting a piece of that pi.
but if i'm hosting on prem, I shouldn't have to pay a hundred dollars a year just to install a few applications.
keep in mind, that person is already paying for internet, electricity, and a few other things around these parts.
they don't (or sometimes, can't) pay for another subscription on top of other payments.
gotta keep the lights going somehow...@adisonverlice2 IMHO you're confusing apples and pears - that's the polite expression, there are others.
It seems you COMPLETELY underestimate or misunderstand the ongoing work needed to maintain and develop Cloudron, and keep it stable.Cloudron is not providing some hardware, and some base software or reselling / redistributing a 3rd party software (eg pfSense).
I completely fail to understand why anyone would agree to receive a single payment for the next xx years work they have to do, unless that is 20x the annual price.
I repeat : pay a single fee for perpetual licence for a fixed version of Cloudron ? maybe that might work. Want the benefits of a maintained platform with upgrades, forget it.
I've had enough of this discussion, which is IMHO is just plain silly.
-
hi!
cloudron should have a perpetual licensing feature meaning you pay once for the subscriptions, and then you never pay again.
alternatively, cloudron should have an appliance, or a server you can purchase, with cloudron software supplyed in, and then you get lifetime subscription. it would never have to connect to a cloudron account, as some people like myself like things to be local. or, it should only have to connect once, and then never again.
some people don't have enough money to pay yearly, or want a way to save some of their money...
I know netgate works similarly. you pay once for the hardware, you get PFSense plus for as long as that appliance is active, with lifetime support/updates, with the exception of technical support (which is understandable) so cloudron should do something similar...@adisonverlice2 said in perpetual licensing:
a perpetual licensing feature meaning you pay once for the subscriptions, and then you never pay again.
That makes no sense whatsoever. The very idea of a subscription is that you pay MORE THAN ONCE. I get that everyone's fed up with everything being a subscription these days (fridges, for crying out loud...) but in the case of actively developed software that model actually makes sense.
What I find quite repulsive though is charging double for monthly subscribers.
-
I like the Idea of having Tiered Pricing. 2 apps= free, 10 apps= $50, 20 apps= $90, Unlimited $180. Just as an example. You have 10 apps installed and need to add an additional one well you have to upgrade. But I don't like the Idea of a perpetual licensing. There's no incentives to grow and improve the software if there's no monthly or yearly reoccurring income. Just look at Unraid. Just my 2 cents.
