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  3. Updates for apps sorted by size

Updates for apps sorted by size

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    • P Offline
      P Offline
      privsec
      wrote on last edited by
      #1

      Hello,

      I am wanting to reduce my cost for wasabi every month and would like to know which apps have what amount of storage they are using.

      For example, let’s assume I have two apps-
      Nextcloud and Wordpress
      I would like to see a way or subsection under the backups of each app that tells me how many mbs/gbs each apps back up is.

      I’m currently paying close to $100 a month in storage cost for my cloudron back ups and would love to see this number GREATLY reduce and I can start doing this by seeing which apps have the most data.

      I just don’t understand how I’m storing close to 8 tv of data in wasabi and deleting 4-6tb every month.

      girishG marcusquinnM 2 Replies Last reply
      2
      • P privsec

        Hello,

        I am wanting to reduce my cost for wasabi every month and would like to know which apps have what amount of storage they are using.

        For example, let’s assume I have two apps-
        Nextcloud and Wordpress
        I would like to see a way or subsection under the backups of each app that tells me how many mbs/gbs each apps back up is.

        I’m currently paying close to $100 a month in storage cost for my cloudron back ups and would love to see this number GREATLY reduce and I can start doing this by seeing which apps have the most data.

        I just don’t understand how I’m storing close to 8 tv of data in wasabi and deleting 4-6tb every month.

        girishG Offline
        girishG Offline
        girish
        Staff
        wrote on last edited by
        #2

        Showing backup size is already planned in 7.4.

        @privsec said in Updates for apps sorted by size:

        I’m currently paying close to $100 a month

        Wow, that seems a lot! I recall @marcusquinn saying there is some hidden clause in wasabi that they don't delete data doe 6 months or something (even if you delete). Is that the reason?

        1 Reply Last reply
        2
        • P privsec

          Hello,

          I am wanting to reduce my cost for wasabi every month and would like to know which apps have what amount of storage they are using.

          For example, let’s assume I have two apps-
          Nextcloud and Wordpress
          I would like to see a way or subsection under the backups of each app that tells me how many mbs/gbs each apps back up is.

          I’m currently paying close to $100 a month in storage cost for my cloudron back ups and would love to see this number GREATLY reduce and I can start doing this by seeing which apps have the most data.

          I just don’t understand how I’m storing close to 8 tv of data in wasabi and deleting 4-6tb every month.

          marcusquinnM Offline
          marcusquinnM Offline
          marcusquinn
          wrote on last edited by
          #3

          @privsec Ouch, that's way too much for personal use!

          1. You must make sure that version history is OFF for ALL buckets.
          2. They do have a 3 month data retention charge, so even if you do reduce storage, you'll still be paying for the highest amount used for another 3 months.
          3. Make sure all your backups are Tarball, it uses a lot less disk space, and is just as fast, if not faster to upload.
          4. Checkout idrive.com/e2, I've moved from Wasabi to that now, and happy with it for cost, especially with Tarball backups being that much less in disk space. Again, you don't need version history on any backups, that would just be duplicate data that Cloudron already covers with your retention settings.

          Web Design https://www.evergreen.je
          Development https://brandlight.org
          Life https://marcusquinn.com

          1 Reply Last reply
          2
          • jdaviescoatesJ Offline
            jdaviescoatesJ Offline
            jdaviescoates
            wrote on last edited by
            #4

            That does sound insanely expensive!

            Just to also add, I'm doing daily back-ups of 49 apps that total 247.12 GB (plus a few other small Cloudrons too) and my backups (all tarball backups) comes to a total of 3.63 TB and I've got all that stored on a 5TB Hetzner that only costs €13.08/mo

            I use Cloudron with Gandi & Hetzner

            subvenS 1 Reply Last reply
            0
            • jdaviescoatesJ jdaviescoates

              That does sound insanely expensive!

              Just to also add, I'm doing daily back-ups of 49 apps that total 247.12 GB (plus a few other small Cloudrons too) and my backups (all tarball backups) comes to a total of 3.63 TB and I've got all that stored on a 5TB Hetzner that only costs €13.08/mo

              subvenS Offline
              subvenS Offline
              subven
              wrote on last edited by
              #5

              @jdaviescoates said in Updates for apps sorted by size:

              That does sound insanely expensive!

              Just to also add, I'm doing daily back-ups of 49 apps that total 247.12 GB (plus a few other small Cloudrons too) and my backups (all tarball backups) comes to a total of 3.63 TB and I've got all that stored on a 5TB Hetzner that only costs €13.08/mo

              Same for me ^^ I also use the same storagebox for my Laptop, mobile and Desktop backups mostly done with Duplicati.

              As my Cloudron grows I want to switch over to RSYNC because at the moment, TGZ is still faster because of many, many, many small files.

              1 Reply Last reply
              0
              • marcusquinnM Offline
                marcusquinnM Offline
                marcusquinn
                wrote on last edited by
                #6

                Paid $20 for 5TB for a year with idrive.com/e2 sign-up offer.

                Web Design https://www.evergreen.je
                Development https://brandlight.org
                Life https://marcusquinn.com

                jdaviescoatesJ J 2 Replies Last reply
                1
                • marcusquinnM marcusquinn

                  Paid $20 for 5TB for a year with idrive.com/e2 sign-up offer.

                  jdaviescoatesJ Offline
                  jdaviescoatesJ Offline
                  jdaviescoates
                  wrote on last edited by
                  #7

                  @marcusquinn said in Updates for apps sorted by size:

                  Paid $20 for 5TB for a year with idrive.com/e2 sign-up offer.

                  Those are still the prices too:

                  467267a4-210a-4eaa-832b-4e2daa6988c1-image.png

                  That is insanely cheap for the first year, although I note their prices are slightly higher than Hetzner after that first year.

                  I use Cloudron with Gandi & Hetzner

                  P 1 Reply Last reply
                  1
                  • P Offline
                    P Offline
                    privsec
                    wrote on last edited by
                    #8

                    This is partly why I want to know what apps have what amount of space in backups.

                    I have 5.6 tb of data in wasabi, but I have no idea as to why its that high d98a0481-8060-4669-a745-af4a1db844bd-image.png

                    It does look like my backups in cloudron do not list all the backups in Wasabi

                    6ef4af76-f44a-45d6-af18-36de8b8df3a6-image.png

                    MY thought process is that this is an issue/bug

                    jdaviescoatesJ marcusquinnM subvenS 4 Replies Last reply
                    0
                    • P privsec

                      This is partly why I want to know what apps have what amount of space in backups.

                      I have 5.6 tb of data in wasabi, but I have no idea as to why its that high d98a0481-8060-4669-a745-af4a1db844bd-image.png

                      It does look like my backups in cloudron do not list all the backups in Wasabi

                      6ef4af76-f44a-45d6-af18-36de8b8df3a6-image.png

                      MY thought process is that this is an issue/bug

                      jdaviescoatesJ Offline
                      jdaviescoatesJ Offline
                      jdaviescoates
                      wrote on last edited by
                      #9

                      @privsec I just want to make sure you've seen this post?

                      @marcusquinn said in Updates for apps sorted by size:

                      @privsec Ouch, that's way too much for personal use!

                      1. You must make sure that version history is OFF for ALL buckets.
                      2. They do have a 3 month data retention charge, so even if you do reduce storage, you'll still be paying for the highest amount used for another 3 months.
                      3. Make sure all your backups are Tarball, it uses a lot less disk space, and is just as fast, if not faster to upload.
                      4. Checkout idrive.com/e2, I've moved from Wasabi to that now, and happy with it for cost, especially with Tarball backups being that much less in disk space. Again, you don't need version history on any backups, that would just be duplicate data that Cloudron already covers with your retention settings.

                      If you haven't turned of version history for all your buckets this is likely the cause.

                      I use Cloudron with Gandi & Hetzner

                      P 1 Reply Last reply
                      1
                      • P privsec

                        This is partly why I want to know what apps have what amount of space in backups.

                        I have 5.6 tb of data in wasabi, but I have no idea as to why its that high d98a0481-8060-4669-a745-af4a1db844bd-image.png

                        It does look like my backups in cloudron do not list all the backups in Wasabi

                        6ef4af76-f44a-45d6-af18-36de8b8df3a6-image.png

                        MY thought process is that this is an issue/bug

                        marcusquinnM Offline
                        marcusquinnM Offline
                        marcusquinn
                        wrote on last edited by
                        #10

                        @privsec Sounds like it is because you have Wasabi bucket versioning on, which is basically ballooning your account every time you backup, as it's making copies of ever file, every time. Been there, had the same issue, they are a bitch for having that gotchya setting by default, and they also won't let you delete your card details - ever - so only way not to pay on leaving them is cancelling your card. Even then, I have a feeling they'd get threatening.

                        Web Design https://www.evergreen.je
                        Development https://brandlight.org
                        Life https://marcusquinn.com

                        1 Reply Last reply
                        1
                        • P privsec

                          This is partly why I want to know what apps have what amount of space in backups.

                          I have 5.6 tb of data in wasabi, but I have no idea as to why its that high d98a0481-8060-4669-a745-af4a1db844bd-image.png

                          It does look like my backups in cloudron do not list all the backups in Wasabi

                          6ef4af76-f44a-45d6-af18-36de8b8df3a6-image.png

                          MY thought process is that this is an issue/bug

                          marcusquinnM Offline
                          marcusquinnM Offline
                          marcusquinn
                          wrote on last edited by
                          #11

                          @privsec Not a Cloudron issue or bug - its a Wasabi business model and default settings costly annoyance. Sorry you found this out the hard way. I've tried to highlight a few times around the forum.

                          Web Design https://www.evergreen.je
                          Development https://brandlight.org
                          Life https://marcusquinn.com

                          1 Reply Last reply
                          0
                          • jdaviescoatesJ jdaviescoates

                            @privsec I just want to make sure you've seen this post?

                            @marcusquinn said in Updates for apps sorted by size:

                            @privsec Ouch, that's way too much for personal use!

                            1. You must make sure that version history is OFF for ALL buckets.
                            2. They do have a 3 month data retention charge, so even if you do reduce storage, you'll still be paying for the highest amount used for another 3 months.
                            3. Make sure all your backups are Tarball, it uses a lot less disk space, and is just as fast, if not faster to upload.
                            4. Checkout idrive.com/e2, I've moved from Wasabi to that now, and happy with it for cost, especially with Tarball backups being that much less in disk space. Again, you don't need version history on any backups, that would just be duplicate data that Cloudron already covers with your retention settings.

                            If you haven't turned of version history for all your buckets this is likely the cause.

                            P Offline
                            P Offline
                            privsec
                            wrote on last edited by
                            #12

                            @jdaviescoates said in Updates for apps sorted by size:

                            @privsec I just want to make sure you've seen this post?

                            @marcusquinn said in Updates for apps sorted by size:

                            @privsec Ouch, that's way too much for personal use!

                            1. You must make sure that version history is OFF for ALL buckets.
                            2. They do have a 3 month data retention charge, so even if you do reduce storage, you'll still be paying for the highest amount used for another 3 months.
                            3. Make sure all your backups are Tarball, it uses a lot less disk space, and is just as fast, if not faster to upload.
                            4. Checkout idrive.com/e2, I've moved from Wasabi to that now, and happy with it for cost, especially with Tarball backups being that much less in disk space. Again, you don't need version history on any backups, that would just be duplicate data that Cloudron already covers with your retention settings.

                            If you haven't turned of version history for all your buckets this is likely the cause.

                            @marcusquinn said in Updates for apps sorted by size:

                            @privsec Sounds like it is because you have Wasabi bucket versioning on, which is basically ballooning your account every time you backup, as it's making copies of ever file, every time. Been there, had the same issue, they are a bitch for having that gotchya setting by default, and they also won't let you delete your card details - ever - so only way not to pay on leaving them is cancelling your card. Even then, I have a feeling they'd get threatening.

                            @marcusquinn said in Updates for apps sorted by size:

                            @privsec Not a Cloudron issue or bug - its a Wasabi business model and default settings costly annoyance. Sorry you found this out the hard way. I've tried to highlight a few times around the forum.

                            I have confirmed versioning is not turned on
                            d6513102-582a-43d4-abfa-8e3c5024168a-image.png

                            This is my utilization overview
                            97922aa0-f7e7-4de3-84dc-66ddac29a813-image.png

                            1 Reply Last reply
                            0
                            • P privsec

                              This is partly why I want to know what apps have what amount of space in backups.

                              I have 5.6 tb of data in wasabi, but I have no idea as to why its that high d98a0481-8060-4669-a745-af4a1db844bd-image.png

                              It does look like my backups in cloudron do not list all the backups in Wasabi

                              6ef4af76-f44a-45d6-af18-36de8b8df3a6-image.png

                              MY thought process is that this is an issue/bug

                              subvenS Offline
                              subvenS Offline
                              subven
                              wrote on last edited by subven
                              #13

                              @privsec said in Updates for apps sorted by size:

                              I have 5.6 tb of data in wasabi, but I have no idea as to why its that high

                              Just purge (empty) your Cloudron bucket at Wasabi. Utilisation for your account should be 0 now. Make a (manual) backup afterwards. If you use TGZ, your app backups are compressed and it should be easy to determine individual size. Also check back overall utilisation of storage within your Wasabi. Now make another backup and compare the groth per backup done. If you keep track on this process over lets say a week, you will find out whats going wrong.

                              PS: How many data does your Cloudron + apps store? You can find out at System Info.

                              EDIT: I guess I found the answer to your question.

                              @privsec said in Updates for apps sorted by size:

                              This is my utilization overview

                              Take a look at this: How does Wasabi's minimum storage duration policy work?

                              I did not read the page but at first glance I can safely assume what is going on 😉 Maybe move away from Wasabi and use other known good services like Hetzner Storagebox. In case it is not obvious: Wasabi lets you pay for data you did already delete (the black bar in the graph) in addition to data you store at the moment (green bar).

                              P 2 Replies Last reply
                              0
                              • subvenS subven

                                @privsec said in Updates for apps sorted by size:

                                I have 5.6 tb of data in wasabi, but I have no idea as to why its that high

                                Just purge (empty) your Cloudron bucket at Wasabi. Utilisation for your account should be 0 now. Make a (manual) backup afterwards. If you use TGZ, your app backups are compressed and it should be easy to determine individual size. Also check back overall utilisation of storage within your Wasabi. Now make another backup and compare the groth per backup done. If you keep track on this process over lets say a week, you will find out whats going wrong.

                                PS: How many data does your Cloudron + apps store? You can find out at System Info.

                                EDIT: I guess I found the answer to your question.

                                @privsec said in Updates for apps sorted by size:

                                This is my utilization overview

                                Take a look at this: How does Wasabi's minimum storage duration policy work?

                                I did not read the page but at first glance I can safely assume what is going on 😉 Maybe move away from Wasabi and use other known good services like Hetzner Storagebox. In case it is not obvious: Wasabi lets you pay for data you did already delete (the black bar in the graph) in addition to data you store at the moment (green bar).

                                P Offline
                                P Offline
                                privsec
                                wrote on last edited by
                                #14

                                @subven

                                Disk Utilization
                                977ca536-9ebc-485d-b10e-02bfd130b480-image.png

                                Encryption settings
                                9a6c06bf-e08b-447a-a9af-c4180f59773d-image.png

                                P 1 Reply Last reply
                                0
                                • subvenS subven

                                  @privsec said in Updates for apps sorted by size:

                                  I have 5.6 tb of data in wasabi, but I have no idea as to why its that high

                                  Just purge (empty) your Cloudron bucket at Wasabi. Utilisation for your account should be 0 now. Make a (manual) backup afterwards. If you use TGZ, your app backups are compressed and it should be easy to determine individual size. Also check back overall utilisation of storage within your Wasabi. Now make another backup and compare the groth per backup done. If you keep track on this process over lets say a week, you will find out whats going wrong.

                                  PS: How many data does your Cloudron + apps store? You can find out at System Info.

                                  EDIT: I guess I found the answer to your question.

                                  @privsec said in Updates for apps sorted by size:

                                  This is my utilization overview

                                  Take a look at this: How does Wasabi's minimum storage duration policy work?

                                  I did not read the page but at first glance I can safely assume what is going on 😉 Maybe move away from Wasabi and use other known good services like Hetzner Storagebox. In case it is not obvious: Wasabi lets you pay for data you did already delete (the black bar in the graph) in addition to data you store at the moment (green bar).

                                  P Offline
                                  P Offline
                                  privsec
                                  wrote on last edited by
                                  #15

                                  @subven
                                  I understand that Cloudron is deleting backups and Wasabi is charging for that, however, thats only part of the issue.

                                  My backup size though should not be anywhere nere 6 TBs even if an exact image copy of my server is uploaded to wasabi at each backup.

                                  Backup settings
                                  dd5837bc-d059-4e4d-8354-449dc9ecd1f1-image.png

                                  The problem will simply follow me around until I discern why Cloudron has so many files "backed up" when according to cloudron, not many are.

                                  subvenS marcusquinnM 2 Replies Last reply
                                  0
                                  • P privsec

                                    @subven
                                    I understand that Cloudron is deleting backups and Wasabi is charging for that, however, thats only part of the issue.

                                    My backup size though should not be anywhere nere 6 TBs even if an exact image copy of my server is uploaded to wasabi at each backup.

                                    Backup settings
                                    dd5837bc-d059-4e4d-8354-449dc9ecd1f1-image.png

                                    The problem will simply follow me around until I discern why Cloudron has so many files "backed up" when according to cloudron, not many are.

                                    subvenS Offline
                                    subvenS Offline
                                    subven
                                    wrote on last edited by
                                    #16

                                    @privsec said in Updates for apps sorted by size:

                                    My backup size though should not be anywhere nere 6 TBs

                                    Where do you get the 6TB number from? Is it the green bar from your Wasabi account? Go into your invoices at Wasabi and take a look at the Deleted Storage vs Total Storage numbers.

                                    Also: 4 backups per month = 4 x ~500GB + extra backups for plattform and app backups. This could be something around 3-4TB in actual backup size + even more "dead" (deleted) storage you use because of the retention policy.

                                    1 Reply Last reply
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                                    • subvenS Offline
                                      subvenS Offline
                                      subven
                                      wrote on last edited by subven
                                      #17

                                      One of my main Cloudrons with ~75GB in appdata including mail + box.

                                      2023-02-02 05_22_11-Window.png

                                      Daily backups with 1 week retention.

                                      2023-02-02 05_22_32-Window.png

                                      Backup storage usage is 552GB in total. Some folders are older then they should be but they do not contain full backups as I also have stopped apps.
                                      sewwfwezte4wwz.png

                                      Total size for the "out of scope" folders is 57GB.

                                      segfererhg.png

                                      Lets do the math! Assumed backup size = 75GB * 7 days = 525 GB (without compression).
                                      If I factor in compression it is 55-60GB * 7 days = 385-420 GB.

                                      Real size 552GB so it is around 1/3 more then I would assume. This seems fine to me since additional plattform backups and app backups before updates are also included.

                                      btw. this is from a 5TB Hetzner storage box 🙂

                                      1 Reply Last reply
                                      0
                                      • P privsec

                                        @subven
                                        I understand that Cloudron is deleting backups and Wasabi is charging for that, however, thats only part of the issue.

                                        My backup size though should not be anywhere nere 6 TBs even if an exact image copy of my server is uploaded to wasabi at each backup.

                                        Backup settings
                                        dd5837bc-d059-4e4d-8354-449dc9ecd1f1-image.png

                                        The problem will simply follow me around until I discern why Cloudron has so many files "backed up" when according to cloudron, not many are.

                                        marcusquinnM Offline
                                        marcusquinnM Offline
                                        marcusquinn
                                        wrote on last edited by marcusquinn
                                        #18

                                        @privsec Seriously, get yourself off of Wasabi, OK service, but sharks for bill shock. You could get yourself setup with IDrive E2, change to Tarball backups, and delete all your Wasabi buckets in the time it's taking to go through all this diagnostics. It's not a Cloudron issue, it's a Wasabi trickery issue, their interface is shit, their retention policy is annoying, their manners were never that helpful when I had the same issue.

                                        Web Design https://www.evergreen.je
                                        Development https://brandlight.org
                                        Life https://marcusquinn.com

                                        timconsidineT P 2 Replies Last reply
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                                        • marcusquinnM marcusquinn

                                          @privsec Seriously, get yourself off of Wasabi, OK service, but sharks for bill shock. You could get yourself setup with IDrive E2, change to Tarball backups, and delete all your Wasabi buckets in the time it's taking to go through all this diagnostics. It's not a Cloudron issue, it's a Wasabi trickery issue, their interface is shit, their retention policy is annoying, their manners were never that helpful when I had the same issue.

                                          timconsidineT Offline
                                          timconsidineT Offline
                                          timconsidine
                                          App Dev
                                          wrote on last edited by
                                          #19

                                          @marcusquinn said in Updates for apps sorted by size:

                                          Seriously, get yourself off of Wasabi, OK service, but sharks for bill shock

                                          Absolutely
                                          I stopped using Wasabi and use Scaleway

                                          1 Reply Last reply
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                                          • marcusquinnM marcusquinn

                                            @privsec Seriously, get yourself off of Wasabi, OK service, but sharks for bill shock. You could get yourself setup with IDrive E2, change to Tarball backups, and delete all your Wasabi buckets in the time it's taking to go through all this diagnostics. It's not a Cloudron issue, it's a Wasabi trickery issue, their interface is shit, their retention policy is annoying, their manners were never that helpful when I had the same issue.

                                            P Offline
                                            P Offline
                                            privsec
                                            wrote on last edited by
                                            #20

                                            @marcusquinn I get it, totally. And I plan on it.
                                            But the original issue remains.

                                            Even If I switch services, without versioning I have nearly 6TB of data being stored.

                                            I want to know where that's from so I can prune as needed.

                                            subvenS jdaviescoatesJ 2 Replies Last reply
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