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    Solved Meet Kopano (unstable version) - a few questions & problems :)

    Kopano Meet
    kopano meetup
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    • fbartels
      fbartels App Dev @jdaviescoates last edited by

      Hi @jdaviescoates,

      that all in all sounds strange. Especially freezing when trying to screenshare is nothing I have seen here so far.

      O 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
      • nebulon
        nebulon Staff last edited by

        I remember @fbartels mentioning some browser session debugging tool to collect relevant information in such a case, maybe that can help sort our some of those cases. Overall we had generally a good experience so far with the app, but given all the various browsers and their various states of webrtc it seems to be a hard issue to tackle.

        1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
        • O
          oj @fbartels last edited by

          Hi @fbartels,

          Just had my first few one-on-one video calls with registered users and guests... Iridium browser at my end and Chrome at the other end. Worked flawlessly...even with 4G at my end. Excellent user experience at both ends. Thanks for bringing Kopano Meet to Cloudron!

          1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 2
          • N
            NCKNE last edited by NCKNE

            Hello @fbartels,

            I just installed Kopano Meet to give it a try and encountered the following error after installation on cloudron v5.1.4 with Kopano Meet version 2.1.0 (Package v1.2.1):

            Apr 15 17:16:33 2020/04/15 15:16:33 Waiting for https://meet.xxx.xx/.well-known/openid-configuration: unexpected HTTP status code: 404.
            Apr 15 17:16:33 2020/04/15 15:16:33 Failed to wait: timed out: https://meet.xxx.xx/.well-known/openid-configuration.
            Apr 15 17:16:33 time="2020-04-15T15:16:33Z" level=info msg="serve start"
            Apr 15 17:16:33 time="2020-04-15T15:16:33Z" level=info msg="using external TURN service: https://turnauth.kopano.com/turnserverauth/"
            Apr 15 17:16:33 time="2020-04-15T15:16:33Z" level=info msg="serve started"
            Apr 15 17:16:43 time="2020-04-15T15:16:43Z" level=warning msg="failed to initialize OIDC provider" error="Timeout (:0x105)" iss="https://meet.xxx.xx"
            Apr 15 17:16:43 time="2020-04-15T15:16:43Z" level=warning msg="admin: using random admin tokens singing key - API endpoint admin disabled"
            Apr 15 17:16:43 time="2020-04-15T15:16:43Z" level=info msg="pattern ^group/public/.* public guest rooms enabled" manager=guest
            Apr 15 17:16:43 time="2020-04-15T15:16:43Z" level=info msg="guest: API endpoint enabled"
            Apr 15 17:16:43 time="2020-04-15T15:16:43Z" level=info msg="rtm: API endpoint enabled"
            Apr 15 17:16:43 time="2020-04-15T15:16:43Z" level=info msg="starting http listener" listenAddr="127.0.0.1:8778"
            Apr 15 17:16:43 time="2020-04-15T15:16:43Z" level=info msg="ready to handle requests"
            

            The app starts, but no login is possible (the login button on the Kopano Meet page does not do anything upon clicking).

            On the client side, the following error comes up:

            oidc-client.min.js:718 GET https://meet.xxx.xx/.well-known/openid-configuration 404
            (anonymous) @ oidc-client.min.js:718
            (anonymous) @ oidc-client.min.js:693
            (anonymous) @ oidc-client.min.js:289
            value @ usermanager.js:317
            (anonymous) @ actions.js:667
            w @ runtime.js:62
            (anonymous) @ runtime.js:288
            (anonymous) @ runtime.js:114
            w @ runtime.js:62
            e @ runtime.js:152
            (anonymous) @ runtime.js:187
            o @ runtime.js:186
            (anonymous) @ runtime.js:209
            (anonymous) @ runtime.js:114
            (anonymous) @ runtime.js:233
            (anonymous) @ actions.js:658
            Promise.then (async)
            (anonymous) @ actions.js:656
            (anonymous) @ index.js:8
            dispatch @ applyMiddleware.js:46
            (anonymous) @ actions.js:318
            w @ runtime.js:62
            (anonymous) @ runtime.js:288
            (anonymous) @ runtime.js:114
            w @ runtime.js:62
            e @ runtime.js:152
            (anonymous) @ runtime.js:187
            o @ runtime.js:186
            (anonymous) @ runtime.js:209
            (anonymous) @ runtime.js:114
            (anonymous) @ runtime.js:233
            (anonymous) @ actions.js:309
            (anonymous) @ index.js:8
            dispatch @ applyMiddleware.js:46
            (anonymous) @ actions.js:356
            w @ runtime.js:62
            (anonymous) @ runtime.js:288
            (anonymous) @ runtime.js:114
            w @ runtime.js:62
            e @ runtime.js:152
            (anonymous) @ runtime.js:162
            Promise.then (async)
            e @ runtime.js:161
            (anonymous) @ runtime.js:187
            o @ runtime.js:186
            (anonymous) @ runtime.js:209
            (anonymous) @ runtime.js:114
            (anonymous) @ runtime.js:233
            (anonymous) @ actions.js:316
            (anonymous) @ index.js:8
            dispatch @ applyMiddleware.js:46
            n @ actions.js:216
            (anonymous) @ actions.js:232
            w @ runtime.js:62
            (anonymous) @ runtime.js:288
            (anonymous) @ runtime.js:114
            w @ runtime.js:62
            e @ runtime.js:152
            (anonymous) @ runtime.js:187
            o @ runtime.js:186
            (anonymous) @ runtime.js:209
            (anonymous) @ runtime.js:114
            (anonymous) @ runtime.js:233
            (anonymous) @ actions.js:224
            (anonymous) @ AuthenticatedRoute.js:22
            Promise.then (async)
            render @ AuthenticatedRoute.js:20
            (anonymous) @ react-router.js:444
            Li @ react-dom.production.min.js:4074
            qa @ react-dom.production.min.js:5514
            Ka @ react-dom.production.min.js:5536
            Ds @ react-dom.production.min.js:5958
            Ms @ react-dom.production.min.js:5925
            Es @ react-dom.production.min.js:5860
            es @ react-dom.production.min.js:5787
            enqueueSetState @ react-dom.production.min.js:2790
            (anonymous) @ react.production.min.js:72
            (anonymous) @ Main.js:56
            u @ runtime.js:45
            (anonymous) @ runtime.js:264
            (anonymous) @ runtime.js:98
            r @ asyncToGenerator.js:3
            s @ asyncToGenerator.js:25
            Promise.then (async)
            r @ asyncToGenerator.js:13
            s @ asyncToGenerator.js:25
            (anonymous) @ asyncToGenerator.js:32
            (anonymous) @ asyncToGenerator.js:21
            Promise.then (async)
            value @ Main.js:53
            Ba @ react-dom.production.min.js:4980
            Ga @ react-dom.production.min.js:5123
            (anonymous) @ react-dom.production.min.js:5975
            (anonymous) @ scheduler.production.min.js:274
            Ls @ react-dom.production.min.js:5974
            Ds @ react-dom.production.min.js:5958
            Ms @ react-dom.production.min.js:5925
            Es @ react-dom.production.min.js:5860
            es @ react-dom.production.min.js:5787
            enqueueSetState @ react-dom.production.min.js:2790
            (anonymous) @ react.production.min.js:72
            t @ index.js:240
            (anonymous) @ index.js:250
            Promise.then (async)
            (anonymous) @ index.js:249
            (anonymous) @ index.js:197
            lo @ react-dom.production.min.js:2854
            Ri @ react-dom.production.min.js:3759
            Li @ react-dom.production.min.js:3960
            qa @ react-dom.production.min.js:5514
            Ka @ react-dom.production.min.js:5536
            Ds @ react-dom.production.min.js:5958
            Ms @ react-dom.production.min.js:5925
            Es @ react-dom.production.min.js:5860
            es @ react-dom.production.min.js:5787
            enqueueSetState @ react-dom.production.min.js:2790
            (anonymous) @ react.production.min.js:72
            (anonymous) @ IntlContainer.js:281
            Promise.then (async)
            value @ IntlContainer.js:280
            Ba @ react-dom.production.min.js:4978
            Ga @ react-dom.production.min.js:5123
            (anonymous) @ react-dom.production.min.js:5975
            (anonymous) @ scheduler.production.min.js:274
            Ls @ react-dom.production.min.js:5974
            Ds @ react-dom.production.min.js:5958
            Ms @ react-dom.production.min.js:5925
            Es @ react-dom.production.min.js:5860
            es @ react-dom.production.min.js:5787
            Us @ react-dom.production.min.js:6077
            Ys @ react-dom.production.min.js:6085
            (anonymous) @ react-dom.production.min.js:6276
            (anonymous) @ react-dom.production.min.js:6360
            Is @ react-dom.production.min.js:6007
            Vs @ react-dom.production.min.js:6359
            render @ react-dom.production.min.js:6390
            831 @ app.js:51
            i @ bootstrap:89
            Promise.then (async)
            (anonymous) @ index.js:18
            Promise.then (async)
            184 @ index.js:14
            i @ bootstrap:89
            107 @ main.758e3f7e.chunk.js?__WB_REVISION__=ebc8e0d9096114f5d646:1
            i @ bootstrap:89
            r @ bootstrap:45
            t @ bootstrap:32
            (anonymous) @ main.758e3f7e.chunk.js?__WB_REVISION__=ebc8e0d9096114f5d646:1
            actions.js:251 failed to continue config initialization Error:  (404)
                at XMLHttpRequest.<anonymous> (oidc-client.min.js:715)
            

            Any idea what could be the problem?

            fbartels 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
            • fbartels
              fbartels App Dev @NCKNE last edited by fbartels

              Hi @NCKNE,

              thanks for your feedback. The immediate cause for your error is the 404 when getting the discovery document from the .well-known directory. Can you check if Konnect is running (the program that provides the document)? You can do so when opening a terminal inside of the app and then running supervisorctl status kopano-konnectd.

              What I find especially weird is that you got a 404 (file not found), in case Konnect isn't running this should normally be a 503 (service unavailable). Which version of Cloudron are you on? Where is that machine running (behind dynamic dns)? How do you manage dns (could it be that meet.xxx.xx still points somewhere else)?

              Edit: ah, this seems to be some general breakage with the latest version of Cloudron. https://forum.cloudron.io/post/7396 reports something similar and @girish said a new version is already rolling out.

              1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
              • girish
                girish Staff last edited by

                @fbartels Sorry, yes, my bad. In 5.1.4 I broke apps that serve up .well-known docs of their own 😕

                On a side note, we use Kopano meet for our weeklies and we haven't had any issues.

                1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 2
                • N
                  NCKNE last edited by NCKNE

                  Thanks for the update @girish! The 5.1.5 update of cloudron fixes the error and Kopano Meet is working now.

                  1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 3
                  • luckow
                    luckow translator last edited by luckow

                    Let us find out how many participants are possible with a Kopano Meet app on Cloudron (v5.15).

                    Invitation
                    When: Monday 20. April 21:00 (Europe/Berlin)
                    Where: https://meet.luckow.org/meet/r/join/group/public/cloudron-meetup

                    Please: use chromium/chrome & Headset

                    Specs: netcup vm, 6 CPU, 32 RAM, HDD

                    Bildschirmfoto 2020-04-17 um 19.39.05.png

                    Pronouns: he/him | Primary language: German

                    fbartels scooke 2 Replies Last reply Reply Quote 3
                    • fbartels
                      fbartels App Dev @luckow last edited by

                      @luckow thats a nice idea. I have created a reminder for myself.

                      We once had a call with around 30 participants, but that was not really stable and just a quick test.

                      We are currently working on a sfu for some customers, if there is interest we could do a comparing test afterwards with that kind of a setup.

                      1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 1
                      • scooke
                        scooke @luckow last edited by

                        @luckow I'll join in, thanks.

                        A life lived in fear is a life half-lived

                        1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 1
                        • S
                          stantropics @jdaviescoates last edited by stantropics

                          @jdaviescoates Have you investigated further? I have also tried to a few meetings with 3 to 5 people with several problems. Sometimes people cannot connect at all, sometimes they are not getting any sound or their sound is not transmitted to other participants. Very hard to analyze ...

                          jdaviescoates 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 1
                          • jdaviescoates
                            jdaviescoates @stantropics last edited by

                            @stantropics no not had a chance (nor really sure how to), although I think I read somewhere that with full p2p WebRTC apps like Kopano Meet all users need to have enough bandwidth for all streams or something, is that right @fbartels?

                            Either way it seems most people have so far had a better experience than us... So I'm keen to try more. Will attempt to join the group call..

                            I use Cloudron with Gandi & Hetzner

                            fbartels avatar1024 2 Replies Last reply Reply Quote 1
                            • girish
                              girish Staff last edited by

                              @luckow I will join if my home internet starts working again.

                              1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                              • fbartels
                                fbartels App Dev @jdaviescoates last edited by

                                @jdaviescoates said in Meet Kopano (unstable version) - a few questions & problems 🙂:

                                all users need to have enough bandwidth for all streams or something

                                Yes, with a peer to peer connection all users need to connect to each other participant. Connections in Meet are limited to max 1 Mbit per participant, if a user does not have sufficient bandwidth for that the browser will automatically reduce quality down to a level where video would be deactivated completely.

                                Some more usage questions are answered in https://kopano.com/blog/top-10-things-to-ask-about-kopano-meet/

                                1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 2
                                • avatar1024
                                  avatar1024 @jdaviescoates last edited by

                                  @jdaviescoates said in Meet Kopano (unstable version) - a few questions & problems 🙂:

                                  with full p2p WebRTC apps like Kopano Meet all users need to have enough bandwidth for all streams or something

                                  Here is a nice explanation of the pros and cons of the three main typologies used for video conference: p2p / MCU / SFU

                                  1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 3
                                  • avatar1024
                                    avatar1024 last edited by

                                    Also might be of interest:

                                    An article which test a methodology to compare SFUs, and then test a few of them. Results probably do not reflect real case scenario though.

                                    1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 3
                                    • scooke
                                      scooke last edited by

                                      Sorry for not participating, had some connectivity issues here. How did the call go?

                                      A life lived in fear is a life half-lived

                                      1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                                      • M
                                        msbt App Dev last edited by

                                        you didn't miss it, it's this evening 😉

                                        scooke 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 1
                                        • scooke
                                          scooke @msbt last edited by

                                          @msbt Ah, I had the already-converted time in my head, "9", and then misremembered it as 'am'. Phew.

                                          A life lived in fear is a life half-lived

                                          1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                                          • girish
                                            girish Staff last edited by

                                            That went pretty well! Thanks for joining and @luckow for organizing.

                                            jdaviescoates 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 3
                                            • jdaviescoates
                                              jdaviescoates @girish last edited by

                                              @girish @luckow how many people did it get up to? I wanted to join but alas was having a nightmare of a children's bedtime instead! 😛

                                              I use Cloudron with Gandi & Hetzner

                                              scooke 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 1
                                              • scooke
                                                scooke @jdaviescoates last edited by

                                                @jdaviescoates Seven. One left their video off. We had three reconnections but those were momentary and the reconnection initially resulted in clearer video images each time.

                                                A life lived in fear is a life half-lived

                                                1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 1
                                                • yusf
                                                  yusf last edited by

                                                  How resource-intensive was the session? Was the beefy spec justified?

                                                  1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 1
                                                  • imc67
                                                    imc67 translator last edited by

                                                    Hi all, today I introduced Kopane Meet for the first time in our (volunteers) organization for a video meeting with 1 account and 5 guests.

                                                    It was a disaster! After half an hour trying and frustration we stopped and 4 of them started a WhatsApp groupvideo (Whatsapp has a max of 4?!).

                                                    What went right?
                                                    The first 2 persons (account and 1 guest) succeeded in having audio and video.

                                                    What went wrong?
                                                    All other guests could join (we could see their names) but they didn't see any video or heared audio and the first two didn't see/hear them. They could see themselves in their browser.

                                                    Time to uninstall the app and hopefully Jitsi Meet will be here soon.

                                                    S 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 1
                                                    • yusf
                                                      yusf last edited by

                                                      Sounds like my experience with Kopano. Maybe you can describe device types, browsers and network topology used? I suspect some of the problems derives from part network restrictions but also weak devices and faulty browsers.

                                                      imc67 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 2
                                                      • S
                                                        stantropics @imc67 last edited by

                                                        @imc67 It also sounds exactly like my experience with Kopano meet. I'm trying to analyze whether the problem is somewhere on my side - however, it appears to be a real challenge.

                                                        1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                                                        • imc67
                                                          imc67 translator @yusf last edited by

                                                          @yusf of some I know their devices/browsers:

                                                          1. account: MacOS+Safari = all fine (could see/hear 2.)
                                                          2. guest: MacOS+Safari = all fine (could see/hear account, BTW on same network as account)
                                                          3. guest: MacOS+Safari and iPad+Safari = connected, could see himself, but no audio/video to/from others
                                                          4. guest: iPad+Safari = connected, could see himself, but no audio/video to/from others
                                                          5. guest: Samsung tablet with Chrome = connected, could see himself, but no audio/video to/from others
                                                          6. guest: ? = connected, could see himself, but no audio/video to/from others

                                                          The WhatsApp groupvideo after half an hour strugling with four (2./3./4./5.) went perfect, so it's not a matter of bandwith I guess.

                                                          Cloudron server load or bandwith usage during the "call" was normal, so no increase in CPU resources or network (I use ZABBIX agent on the Cloudron server so can see all stats live and all history is stored).

                                                          fbartels 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                                                          • necrevistonnezr
                                                            necrevistonnezr last edited by

                                                            off-topic: I think one lesson to learn here is that to do video conferencing properly is quite hard. You can hate on Zoom and Teams all you want but if you actually have your work depend on it (e.g. meeting with a client, like I do on a daily basis), it's quite a different story than just having fun with friends.

                                                            1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                                                            • fbartels
                                                              fbartels App Dev @imc67 last edited by

                                                              Hi @imc67,

                                                              browser versions are equally as important as the browser itself. and sadly Safari isn't the best when it comes to supporting modern standard such as PWAs and WebRTC. The general recommendation would be to use Chrome or Chromium based browsers.

                                                              @imc67 said in Meet Kopano (unstable version) - a few questions & problems 🙂:

                                                              Cloudron server load or bandwith usage during the "call" was normal

                                                              Yes, that is to be expected when using WebRTC, the majority of traffic is between individual callers. There are still some connections to the server, like for example a websocket connection to kwmserver for notifications and then of course the connection to the turn server.

                                                              1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 1
                                                              • luckow
                                                                luckow translator last edited by

                                                                Charming participants at the first (virtual) Cloudron meetup 🙂

                                                                kopano-meet.jpg

                                                                Pronouns: he/him | Primary language: German

                                                                O 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 4
                                                                • O
                                                                  oj @luckow last edited by

                                                                  @luckow We should do this again when @fbartels packages "Kopano Meet Boost" on Cloudron!

                                                                  "Kopano Meet Boost is a server that we offer to our enterprise customers to meet this challenge. It is a Selective Forwarding Unit (SFU) that receives only one data stream from the sender and forwards it to all other participants. This drastically reduces the required computing power at the client and saves bandwidth. Thus, video meetings are also possible with 50 and more participants."

                                                                  https://github.com/Kopano-dev/kwmbridge

                                                                  fbartels 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                                                                  • fbartels
                                                                    fbartels App Dev @oj last edited by

                                                                    @oj said in Meet Kopano (unstable version) - a few questions & problems 🙂:

                                                                    packages "Kopano Meet Boost" on Cloudron

                                                                    thats unfortunately a bit impractical to do. kwmbridge requires a large range of udp ports so running it in a container with forwarded ports is quite inefficient (because there is also quite a memory overhead in Docker in this case).

                                                                    But it should be easy to make the app configurable enough to have kwmbridge running on a dedicated host and simply hook up to kwmserver inside of the app. having (multiple) external kwmbridge endpoints is kind of the setup we are expecting anyways.

                                                                    1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 2
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