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  3. Backup Strategy Advice

Backup Strategy Advice

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  • L lucidfox

    so just to update my results here - i tried a hetzner storagebox, but the cifs storage mount was having some stability issues. and it was so painfully slow as to be practically unusable.

    so i switched to another option that i've seen mentioned in the forums here, which is to backup to a second cloudron using minio. and i'm happy to report that it's working fine. using an alphavps storage vps it's actually even cheaper, and it's quite convenient to have a further backup if needed.

    P Offline
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    p44
    translator
    wrote on last edited by
    #19

    @lucidfox Thank's a lot for your advices! How many Cloudron instances you've to backup? With minio you use the same token for everyone?

    L 1 Reply Last reply
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    • P p44

      @lucidfox Thank's a lot for your advices! How many Cloudron instances you've to backup? With minio you use the same token for everyone?

      L Offline
      L Offline
      lucidfox
      wrote on last edited by
      #20

      @p44 I only have the one cloudron to backup at the moment, but I'd imagine you can use the same token or create other buckets and tokens on the same minio server.

      P 1 Reply Last reply
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      • L lucidfox

        @p44 I only have the one cloudron to backup at the moment, but I'd imagine you can use the same token or create other buckets and tokens on the same minio server.

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        p44
        translator
        wrote on last edited by
        #21

        @lucidfox Thank's Lucidfox. about cifs storage mount "stability issues", can you tell me more? Because now seems to be very stable and persistent...

        L 1 Reply Last reply
        1
        • P p44

          @lucidfox Thank's Lucidfox. about cifs storage mount "stability issues", can you tell me more? Because now seems to be very stable and persistent...

          L Offline
          L Offline
          lucidfox
          wrote on last edited by
          #22

          @p44 sometimes in cloudron it would say 'this is not a cifs mount' or something similiar. even though it seemed to have been mounted properly, and showed up when checking via ssh. it could just be something to do with mounting it incorrectly though. i figured it was not worth troubleshooting, because of the slow speeds.

          jdaviescoatesJ P 2 Replies Last reply
          1
          • L lucidfox

            @p44 sometimes in cloudron it would say 'this is not a cifs mount' or something similiar. even though it seemed to have been mounted properly, and showed up when checking via ssh. it could just be something to do with mounting it incorrectly though. i figured it was not worth troubleshooting, because of the slow speeds.

            jdaviescoatesJ Offline
            jdaviescoatesJ Offline
            jdaviescoates
            wrote on last edited by jdaviescoates
            #23

            @lucidfox I just used the mount code provided by Hetzner here https://docs.hetzner.com/robot/storage-box/access/access-samba-cifs/ and have not had any problems

            I use Cloudron with Gandi & Hetzner

            ruihildtR 1 Reply Last reply
            4
            • L lucidfox

              @p44 sometimes in cloudron it would say 'this is not a cifs mount' or something similiar. even though it seemed to have been mounted properly, and showed up when checking via ssh. it could just be something to do with mounting it incorrectly though. i figured it was not worth troubleshooting, because of the slow speeds.

              P Offline
              P Offline
              p44
              translator
              wrote on last edited by
              #24

              @lucidfox Could you paste here your cifs string template?

              L 1 Reply Last reply
              0
              • jdaviescoatesJ jdaviescoates

                @lucidfox I just used the mount code provided by Hetzner here https://docs.hetzner.com/robot/storage-box/access/access-samba-cifs/ and have not had any problems

                ruihildtR Offline
                ruihildtR Offline
                ruihildt
                wrote on last edited by
                #25

                @jdaviescoates Are you using Ubuntu 20?

                jdaviescoatesJ 1 Reply Last reply
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                • ruihildtR ruihildt

                  @jdaviescoates Are you using Ubuntu 20?

                  jdaviescoatesJ Offline
                  jdaviescoatesJ Offline
                  jdaviescoates
                  wrote on last edited by
                  #26

                  @ruihildt said in Backup Strategy Advice:

                  @jdaviescoates Are you using Ubuntu 20?

                  No. 18.04. I figured why change what's not broken 🙂

                  I'll likely use Ubuntu 20 the next time I do a fresh install on Cloudron, but am keeping my existing Cloudron's that I installed on 18.04 on 18.04.

                  I use Cloudron with Gandi & Hetzner

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                  • P p44

                    @lucidfox Could you paste here your cifs string template?

                    L Offline
                    L Offline
                    lucidfox
                    wrote on last edited by
                    #27

                    @p44 i just followed the one in the cloudron docs (and also the hetzner docs).

                    cloudron:
                    //<server>/<remote_folder> /backups_cifs cifs uid=yellowtent,gid=yellowtent,user=<user>,pass=<pass>,iocharset=utf8,x-systemd.automount 0 0

                    hetzner:
                    //<username>.your-storagebox.de/backup /mnt/backup-server cifs iocharset=utf8,rw,credentials=/etc/backup-credentials.txt,uid=<system account>,gid=<system group>,file_mode=0660,dir_mode=0770 0 0

                    P 1 Reply Last reply
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                    • L lucidfox

                      so just to update my results here - i tried a hetzner storagebox, but the cifs storage mount was having some stability issues. and it was so painfully slow as to be practically unusable.

                      so i switched to another option that i've seen mentioned in the forums here, which is to backup to a second cloudron using minio. and i'm happy to report that it's working fine. using an alphavps storage vps it's actually even cheaper, and it's quite convenient to have a further backup if needed.

                      subvenS Offline
                      subvenS Offline
                      subven
                      wrote on last edited by subven
                      #28

                      @lucidfox said in Backup Strategy Advice:

                      so i switched to another option that i've seen mentioned in the forums here, which is to backup to a second cloudron using minio. and i'm happy to report that it's working fine. using an alphavps storage vps it's actually even cheaper, and it's quite convenient to have a further backup if needed.

                      I also did this and it's working fine. I choose a storage VPS at alphavps with 768MB RAM, 256GB HDD and 1TB bandwidth for 25€ per year. Had to resize the root partition and change the free RAM check at the Cloudron setup to be able to install Cloudron. After that I disabled local backups and installed Minio. Backup speed with rsync is okay for small setups and bandwidth should be suffisant since we're doing incremental backups.

                      PS: be aware that they freeze your server at bandwidth overuse

                      Are there any bandwidth overusage fees?
                      No! We understand how frustrating can bandwidth overusage fees be and we've taken a different approach, to ensure our flat and predictable pricing - when you come close to running out of bandwidth, we will send a warning emails. Should you not respond and upgrade the server, we'll suspend it automatically, until the bandwidth counter is reset.

                      scookeS 1 Reply Last reply
                      4
                      • L lucidfox

                        @p44 i just followed the one in the cloudron docs (and also the hetzner docs).

                        cloudron:
                        //<server>/<remote_folder> /backups_cifs cifs uid=yellowtent,gid=yellowtent,user=<user>,pass=<pass>,iocharset=utf8,x-systemd.automount 0 0

                        hetzner:
                        //<username>.your-storagebox.de/backup /mnt/backup-server cifs iocharset=utf8,rw,credentials=/etc/backup-credentials.txt,uid=<system account>,gid=<system group>,file_mode=0660,dir_mode=0770 0 0

                        P Offline
                        P Offline
                        p44
                        translator
                        wrote on last edited by
                        #29

                        @lucidfox said in Backup Strategy Advice:

                        @p44 i just followed the one in the cloudron docs (and also the hetzner docs).

                        cloudron:
                        //<server>/<remote_folder> /backups_cifs cifs uid=yellowtent,gid=yellowtent,user=<user>,pass=<pass>,iocharset=utf8,x-systemd.automount 0 0

                        hetzner:
                        //<username>.your-storagebox.de/backup /mnt/backup-server cifs iocharset=utf8,rw,credentials=/etc/backup-credentials.txt,uid=<system account>,gid=<system group>,file_mode=0660,dir_mode=0770 0 0

                        Which one do you use? These above are standards strings. First one on the top should work.

                        Where is located source datacenter?

                        L 1 Reply Last reply
                        1
                        • P p44

                          @lucidfox said in Backup Strategy Advice:

                          @p44 i just followed the one in the cloudron docs (and also the hetzner docs).

                          cloudron:
                          //<server>/<remote_folder> /backups_cifs cifs uid=yellowtent,gid=yellowtent,user=<user>,pass=<pass>,iocharset=utf8,x-systemd.automount 0 0

                          hetzner:
                          //<username>.your-storagebox.de/backup /mnt/backup-server cifs iocharset=utf8,rw,credentials=/etc/backup-credentials.txt,uid=<system account>,gid=<system group>,file_mode=0660,dir_mode=0770 0 0

                          Which one do you use? These above are standards strings. First one on the top should work.

                          Where is located source datacenter?

                          L Offline
                          L Offline
                          lucidfox
                          wrote on last edited by lucidfox
                          #30

                          @p44 i don't use it anymore. i've switched to a storage vps on alphavps, with a minio backup.

                          P 1 Reply Last reply
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                          • L lucidfox

                            @p44 i don't use it anymore. i've switched to a storage vps on alphavps, with a minio backup.

                            P Offline
                            P Offline
                            p44
                            translator
                            wrote on last edited by
                            #31

                            @lucidfox Ok ! 🙂 Hope it is working fine

                            L 1 Reply Last reply
                            2
                            • P p44

                              @lucidfox Ok ! 🙂 Hope it is working fine

                              L Offline
                              L Offline
                              lucidfox
                              wrote on last edited by
                              #32

                              @p44 thanks, it works great.

                              1 Reply Last reply
                              2
                              • subvenS subven

                                @lucidfox said in Backup Strategy Advice:

                                so i switched to another option that i've seen mentioned in the forums here, which is to backup to a second cloudron using minio. and i'm happy to report that it's working fine. using an alphavps storage vps it's actually even cheaper, and it's quite convenient to have a further backup if needed.

                                I also did this and it's working fine. I choose a storage VPS at alphavps with 768MB RAM, 256GB HDD and 1TB bandwidth for 25€ per year. Had to resize the root partition and change the free RAM check at the Cloudron setup to be able to install Cloudron. After that I disabled local backups and installed Minio. Backup speed with rsync is okay for small setups and bandwidth should be suffisant since we're doing incremental backups.

                                PS: be aware that they freeze your server at bandwidth overuse

                                Are there any bandwidth overusage fees?
                                No! We understand how frustrating can bandwidth overusage fees be and we've taken a different approach, to ensure our flat and predictable pricing - when you come close to running out of bandwidth, we will send a warning emails. Should you not respond and upgrade the server, we'll suspend it automatically, until the bandwidth counter is reset.

                                scookeS Offline
                                scookeS Offline
                                scooke
                                wrote on last edited by
                                #33

                                @subven I'm not seeing the Minio app in the regular store... could you refresh my memory as to how to get it please?

                                A life lived in fear is a life half-lived

                                subvenS 1 Reply Last reply
                                1
                                • scookeS scooke

                                  @subven I'm not seeing the Minio app in the regular store... could you refresh my memory as to how to get it please?

                                  subvenS Offline
                                  subvenS Offline
                                  subven
                                  wrote on last edited by
                                  #34

                                  @scooke actually it is in the normal store. No beta or special tricks required. You need at least Cloudron 5.3.0 to install it.

                                  2021-03-31 10_32_11-Window.png
                                  2021-03-31 10_32_19-Window.png

                                  scookeS 1 Reply Last reply
                                  3
                                  • subvenS subven

                                    @scooke actually it is in the normal store. No beta or special tricks required. You need at least Cloudron 5.3.0 to install it.

                                    2021-03-31 10_32_11-Window.png
                                    2021-03-31 10_32_19-Window.png

                                    scookeS Offline
                                    scookeS Offline
                                    scooke
                                    wrote on last edited by
                                    #35

                                    @subven Huh, so it is. That was weird for me, I scrolled up and down and even typed in the name, before asking you here. But now I can see it easily and clearly. Strange. Thank you!

                                    A life lived in fear is a life half-lived

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                                    • E ethanxrosen referenced this topic
                                    • E Offline
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                                      ethanxrosen
                                      wrote last edited by
                                      #36

                                      I think it probably makes more sense for most people who are using a storage VPS to forego installing Cloudron+Minio and instead just connect to their VPS with SSHFS.

                                      If you use Minio's S3 api, there's a big disadvantage of no hard-links with rsync right? So total backup storage balloons if you want anything but a barebones retention policy. In my case the difference was around 5TB 😅. On the other hand setting up a secure SSH server is almost easier than a second cloudron (get a firewall going and auto update with unattended-upgrades). Not sure how people's experience is with backup stability over SSHFS these days.

                                      Saw that ServaRica had some good prices competitive with Hetzner / alphaVPS.

                                      1 Reply Last reply
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                                      • robiR Offline
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                                        robi
                                        wrote last edited by
                                        #37

                                        Interesting, haven't looked at ServaRica before, they seem to have daily expanding storage plans that start at 500GB of SAN +1 GB daily.

                                        They also have an unlimited storage plan that does +3 GB daily.

                                        Conscious tech

                                        scookeS 1 Reply Last reply
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                                        • jdaviescoatesJ Offline
                                          jdaviescoatesJ Offline
                                          jdaviescoates
                                          wrote last edited by
                                          #38

                                          @d19dotca might be interested in ServaRICA given they are in Canada

                                          I use Cloudron with Gandi & Hetzner

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