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Cloudron Forum

Apps | Demo | Docs | Install

Best privacy chat apps

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  • d19dotcaD Offline
    d19dotcaD Offline
    d19dotca
    replied to marcusquinn on last edited by
    #41

    @marcusquinn said in Best privacy chat apps:

    Who wants to be "targeted" and have others pay to directly target them with a calculation that makes it more probable to profit from that targeting?

    As must as I hate any kind of privacy-invading workflows, I must confess that (specifically) targeted advertising doesn't really bother me much at all. The fact is those ads are going to be present in that spot on a webpage regardless of whether it's targeted or not. So why not at least show me relevant ads based on search keywords in the tool being used?

    To me, the only time I get creeped out and think they've crossed a line for me at least is when they start getting overly sensitive to the ads (such as Facebook) where you're not just being targeted based on a couple of data points and instead you're being targeted based on like a 100+ different data points on data they ideally shouldn't even really have in the first place.

    I think it's all a balancing act. Everyone's comfort level is a little different. Just my opinion anyways. But I totally hear ya on the "I have nothing to hide" point, those statements always irritate me when I hear them from people, shows they're completely missing the point when they say that, IMO.

    --
    Dustin Dauncey
    www.d19.ca

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  • JOduMonTJ Offline
    JOduMonTJ Offline
    JOduMonT
    replied to mehdi on last edited by
    #42

    this table was for my own personal use

    @mehdi said in Best privacy chat apps:

    I personally think it's the most important feature to take into account.

    this is true this feature should be considered,
    but also who own the encryption key, the user or the provider ?

    because most of these service yes you could encrypt a message but the provider (example Telegram) have the 2 keys so technically they could decrypt the message on the server side before forwarding it to the recipient.

    Sometimes a function is just an umbrella to make a shadow theater where we are the puppet.

    mehdiM 1 Reply Last reply
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  • JOduMonTJ Offline
    JOduMonTJ Offline
    JOduMonT
    replied to robi on last edited by
    #43

    @robi said in Best privacy chat apps:

    for Mattermost, what is meant by 'gateway to other services' ? API integrations?

    Yes; but I'm not a Mattermost expert

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  • JOduMonTJ Offline
    JOduMonTJ Offline
    JOduMonT
    replied to mehdi on last edited by JOduMonT
    #44

    @mehdi said in Best privacy chat apps:

    Olvid

    Olvid sound promessing, we cloud also talk about Threema which is more or less the same but developed in Switzerland. but at the end I took my list from AlternativeTo.net and took the top 10.

    Beware most of VOIP use opportunistic encryption mainly because of issues with NAT so trusting a 3rd party for that is a big mistake for your privacy.

    These days everything is secure like email aka the authentication use SSL than the message follow in clear text.

    It would be interesting to find how/if Olvid encrypt their VOIP and which part ANSSI complement.
    for now I only see the text message being encrypted.

    mehdiM 1 Reply Last reply
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  • mehdiM Offline
    mehdiM Offline
    mehdi App Dev
    replied to JOduMonT on last edited by mehdi
    #45

    @jodumont I am of course only talking about good end-to-end encryption, like Signal or WhatsApp (yeah, WhatsApp has many flaws, mainly their owner, but they do have good encryption).

    I don't know about Telegram's encryption, I never looked into it. I just know they don't use any by default (which, in itself, is bad)

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  • mehdiM Offline
    mehdiM Offline
    mehdi App Dev
    replied to JOduMonT on last edited by
    #46

    @jodumont about Olvid, from what I know, yes their calls are also encrypted, but they are only available for paid users.

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  • JOduMonTJ Offline
    JOduMonTJ Offline
    JOduMonT
    wrote on last edited by JOduMonT
    #47

    @mehdi said in Best privacy chat apps:

    I don't know about Telegram's encryption, I never looked into it. I just know they don't use any by default (which, in itself, is bad)

    we probably don't talk about the same phase of encryption, you seams focusing on the message (which obviously it is important) and I'm talking about the transfer

    anyway good thing this forum is encrypted by a SSL 😛

    mehdiM 1 Reply Last reply
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  • mehdiM Offline
    mehdiM Offline
    mehdi App Dev
    replied to JOduMonT on last edited by
    #48

    @jodumont This table seems to be either outdated severly, or just plain wrong. Whatsapp does use end-to-end encryption, and has been using it for years.

    JOduMonTJ 1 Reply Last reply
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  • JOduMonTJ Offline
    JOduMonTJ Offline
    JOduMonT
    replied to mehdi on last edited by
    #49

    @mehdi said in Best privacy chat apps:

    This table seems to be either outdated severly

    fair enough 🙂

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  • jdaviescoatesJ Online
    jdaviescoatesJ Online
    jdaviescoates
    wrote on last edited by
    #50

    I came across a couple of nice chat comparisons recently.

    First of all there is this nice infographic by niboe.info

    compare_chat.png

    Sadly I've been unable to find an English version of the other nice infographic in this accompanying article of theirs in Spanish.

    I also came across this handy table from DivestOS (a privacy focused Android distribution):

    https://divestos.org/index.php?page=messengers

    Both of these make we wish Cloudron had an XMPP server like ejabberd so we could get our friends to try out Conversations and Movim (I mean, both Yunohost and HomeLabsOS have an XMPP server, and they are both fully open source and run by volunteers - whereas Cloudron is the one with a business model and full time paid @staff - and yet they've got XMPP and we don't! 😛 )

    I use Cloudron with Gandi & Hetzner

    JOduMonTJ robiR 2 Replies Last reply
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  • JOduMonTJ Offline
    JOduMonTJ Offline
    JOduMonT
    replied to jdaviescoates on last edited by
    #51

    maybe me, but personally I make a difference when you are able to generate or add your own key to encrypt versus the "platform" provide you the public and private key

    mehdiM 1 Reply Last reply
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  • mehdiM Offline
    mehdiM Offline
    mehdi App Dev
    replied to JOduMonT on last edited by
    #52

    @jodumont The key is always generated on your own device. There is zero reason to allow users to import an external key. If you don't trust the local app to correctly generate a keypair, you have no reason to trust it to correctly perform the encryption. So importing a key brings nothing.

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  • robiR Offline
    robiR Offline
    robi
    replied to jdaviescoates on last edited by
    #53

    @jdaviescoates time to host an event, start packaging and get help finishing it! 🙂

    Life of sky tech

    jdaviescoatesJ 1 Reply Last reply
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  • jdaviescoatesJ Online
    jdaviescoatesJ Online
    jdaviescoates
    replied to robi on last edited by jdaviescoates
    #54

    @robi I've often thought of learning to code. I loved maths as a kid. But now isn't the time. 🙂

    I use Cloudron with Gandi & Hetzner

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  • robiR Offline
    robiR Offline
    robi
    replied to jdaviescoates on last edited by
    #55

    @jdaviescoates there's no real coding involved.. it's mostly stitching things together and adjusting configs. You'll have help too.

    Life of sky tech

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  • marcusquinnM Offline
    marcusquinnM Offline
    marcusquinn
    wrote on last edited by
    #56

    Looks like Signal App's addition of payments using MobileCoin ($MOB) has struck a raw nerve with many.

    Another alternative that seems to come up regularly on the comments underneath their Tweets is this Session App:

    • https://getsession.org

    YMMV but another one for the list and your esteemed critique.

    We're not here for a long time - but we are here for a good time :)
    Jersey/UK
    Work & Ecommerce Advice: https://brandlight.org
    Personal & Software Tips: https://marcusquinn.com

    jdaviescoatesJ 1 Reply Last reply
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  • jdaviescoatesJ Online
    jdaviescoatesJ Online
    jdaviescoates
    replied to marcusquinn on last edited by
    #57

    @marcusquinn see also Snikket which seems like a great option too (and gets my vote for the XMPP that ought to be first added to Cloudron).

    I use Cloudron with Gandi & Hetzner

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  • ? Offline
    ? Offline
    A Former User
    wrote on last edited by A Former User
    #58

    I'd still take Matrix over all of those for its decentralized and federated nature. It is incredibly secure and their Element client has truly come a long way. I would love to see Snikket and Oragono though. I tried packaging Oragono but lost the motivation part way through as I usually do.

    But my vote for matrix comes in here: Me and a friend could both have our own homeservers and still chat in a secure manner. If we're talking privacy, I'd say its at the top for sure.

    jdaviescoatesJ 1 Reply Last reply
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  • jdaviescoatesJ Online
    jdaviescoatesJ Online
    jdaviescoates
    replied to A Former User on last edited by
    #59

    @atrilahiji true, although I find Matrix to still be somewhat of a UX nightmare. It's often very confusing, even for geeky people.

    I use Cloudron with Gandi & Hetzner

    ? 1 Reply Last reply
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  • ? Offline
    ? Offline
    A Former User
    replied to jdaviescoates on last edited by
    #60

    @jdaviescoates I mean, I wouldn't say I'm an expert in UX so I can't speak to that but I can say that for me I found it fairly intuitive. I know that this may not be everyone's experience though.

    I also am wary of UX issues or incredibly pretty apps sometimes because I find that a lot of apps seem to go 110% in on beautiful and intuitive UI while compromising on core functionality.

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