Zulip - Powerful open source group chat
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M marcusquinn referenced this topic on
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M marcusquinn referenced this topic on
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Zulip is one of the applications I use daily and is essential to me. I'm using it for an open-source project, self-hosted. I would be thrilled if it could be an application I could install on Cloudron and use with n8n, Baserow, Jitsi, and other applications available in Cloudron.
Some of the best examples/use cases of using Zulip and its advantages are below:
In addition, they recently have added a public access option, where anyone can view a topic without signing up simply by sharing a link.
One of the largest reasons I use Zulip is to have chats and our information organized as a knowledge base, it's our community's source of truth.
I hope the team considers making Zulip available on Cloudron.
Thank you for all of your hard work and support.
Regards,
Alex -
Zulip is one of the applications I use daily and is essential to me. I'm using it for an open-source project, self-hosted. I would be thrilled if it could be an application I could install on Cloudron and use with n8n, Baserow, Jitsi, and other applications available in Cloudron.
Some of the best examples/use cases of using Zulip and its advantages are below:
In addition, they recently have added a public access option, where anyone can view a topic without signing up simply by sharing a link.
One of the largest reasons I use Zulip is to have chats and our information organized as a knowledge base, it's our community's source of truth.
I hope the team considers making Zulip available on Cloudron.
Thank you for all of your hard work and support.
Regards,
Alex -
@nebulon
I have used Zulip. It has integrated support for video conferencing using Jitsi. I liked it. The developers seemed like good people too. At the time, a few years ago, it seemed like RocketChat was on a more proprietary trajectory than Zulip.Odoo has some chat support too.
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This has over 30 votes, and is one of the top voted apps that is not yet integrated.
On hackernews, when slack pricing changed, zulip seemed to get the highest marks as product-wise as an alternative. Better still than mattermost.
I agree that Zulip would be quite handy as Rocket.chat seem to be going a strange way. I wonder:
Is there anyone currently working on packaging it?
Is there any particular technically difficulty when it comes to integrating it Cloudron? -
+1 for Zulip
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@girish Zulip now has an expiremental Docker image. Is there any chance that could speed up things?
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I keep thinking Zulip would be the chat option that could sway many of my contacts away from Facebook Messenger or WhatsApp.... Matrix+Element and even Rocketchat, for some reason, scare them as being too technical.
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now it has 40 upvotes
Lets GOOOOOooooooo
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I keep thinking Zulip would be the chat option that could sway many of my contacts away from Facebook Messenger or WhatsApp.... Matrix+Element and even Rocketchat, for some reason, scare them as being too technical.
@scooke I gave up on that quest a long time ago.
People resist anything they think is effort or unpopular. That's why hyper-scaling capitalism has been so successful and every social media platform a business is expected to be on the ones from the hyper-growth capitalism capital of the tech world.
I see people using WhatsApp and Messenger as no different to people that work production lines to make my devices and clothing. Most just don't want to know any different, as then they'd have to be unsatisfied with their status quo.
It's more valuable for business to keep people believing, and do whatever it takes to retain those "users" (ironic term considering it is also common in describing drug addicts), than it is for them to try lesser-known alternatives, regardless of their superior privacy. So you're competing against an industry of global indoctrination as a business model in that persuasion endeavour.
For me it's:
Nextcloud Talk for all business and organisation ventures.
Signal for my friends and family that care about privacy, although that also has its issues, mainly in lack of ability to export data.
Mattermost + Element I believe has some traction with UK Government using it, and perhaps others, but even I found it confusing to get working at first.
WhatEver for everyone else that's too lazy to care about their own freedom and finds more comfort in giving their value to brands.
It baffles me how many people I care about are addicted to diet sodas, too, but regardless of caring, they just don't see the harm, and worse see anyone's attempts to divert them from such perceived minor vices as an attack on their freedom to choose, even if they know it's a junk brand, it gives them comfort because popularity feels safer than healthy to many.
Web Design https://www.evergreen.je
Development https://brandlight.org
Life https://marcusquinn.com -
@scooke I gave up on that quest a long time ago.
People resist anything they think is effort or unpopular. That's why hyper-scaling capitalism has been so successful and every social media platform a business is expected to be on the ones from the hyper-growth capitalism capital of the tech world.
I see people using WhatsApp and Messenger as no different to people that work production lines to make my devices and clothing. Most just don't want to know any different, as then they'd have to be unsatisfied with their status quo.
It's more valuable for business to keep people believing, and do whatever it takes to retain those "users" (ironic term considering it is also common in describing drug addicts), than it is for them to try lesser-known alternatives, regardless of their superior privacy. So you're competing against an industry of global indoctrination as a business model in that persuasion endeavour.
For me it's:
Nextcloud Talk for all business and organisation ventures.
Signal for my friends and family that care about privacy, although that also has its issues, mainly in lack of ability to export data.
Mattermost + Element I believe has some traction with UK Government using it, and perhaps others, but even I found it confusing to get working at first.
WhatEver for everyone else that's too lazy to care about their own freedom and finds more comfort in giving their value to brands.
It baffles me how many people I care about are addicted to diet sodas, too, but regardless of caring, they just don't see the harm, and worse see anyone's attempts to divert them from such perceived minor vices as an attack on their freedom to choose, even if they know it's a junk brand, it gives them comfort because popularity feels safer than healthy to many.
@marcusquinn said in Zulip - Powerful open source group chat:
and do whatever it takes to retain those "users" (ironic term considering it is also common in describing drug addicts)
Great insight!
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@scooke I gave up on that quest a long time ago.
People resist anything they think is effort or unpopular. That's why hyper-scaling capitalism has been so successful and every social media platform a business is expected to be on the ones from the hyper-growth capitalism capital of the tech world.
I see people using WhatsApp and Messenger as no different to people that work production lines to make my devices and clothing. Most just don't want to know any different, as then they'd have to be unsatisfied with their status quo.
It's more valuable for business to keep people believing, and do whatever it takes to retain those "users" (ironic term considering it is also common in describing drug addicts), than it is for them to try lesser-known alternatives, regardless of their superior privacy. So you're competing against an industry of global indoctrination as a business model in that persuasion endeavour.
For me it's:
Nextcloud Talk for all business and organisation ventures.
Signal for my friends and family that care about privacy, although that also has its issues, mainly in lack of ability to export data.
Mattermost + Element I believe has some traction with UK Government using it, and perhaps others, but even I found it confusing to get working at first.
WhatEver for everyone else that's too lazy to care about their own freedom and finds more comfort in giving their value to brands.
It baffles me how many people I care about are addicted to diet sodas, too, but regardless of caring, they just don't see the harm, and worse see anyone's attempts to divert them from such perceived minor vices as an attack on their freedom to choose, even if they know it's a junk brand, it gives them comfort because popularity feels safer than healthy to many.
@marcusquinn said in Zulip - Powerful open source group chat:
It baffles me
I just found the "right-click, highlight text in post, quote" function. Anyway, I definitely agree, it is baffling and it is also a bit exasperating sometimes. A natural impulse to try and help others then needs to be self-curtailed. One ends up wanting to no longer support society.
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@marcusquinn said in Zulip - Powerful open source group chat:
It baffles me
I just found the "right-click, highlight text in post, quote" function. Anyway, I definitely agree, it is baffling and it is also a bit exasperating sometimes. A natural impulse to try and help others then needs to be self-curtailed. One ends up wanting to no longer support society.
@LoudLemur I think the reality of the modern online world is everyone has multiple personas. There's the systems we use because we have to, and we are one persona there, and the systems we use because we want to, and we can be another persona there. Then there's the personas we can have offline and off grid.
The best protection anyone can have is just to make the persona that has to use systems unwillingly the least valuable to those trying to extract excess value from it, and reserve our most valuable creations for private systems and places.
Even this conversation would be wildly different on a public platform compared to in a pub.
Going back to Zulip. I don't see video and voice. Same for Rocket.Chat. Hence, for me, this one remains a luxury app to package, when Nextcloud Talk and Element do have those.
Sometimes we don't need every option, just the current best of the best, which I feel we already have.
Web Design https://www.evergreen.je
Development https://brandlight.org
Life https://marcusquinn.com -
@LoudLemur I think the reality of the modern online world is everyone has multiple personas. There's the systems we use because we have to, and we are one persona there, and the systems we use because we want to, and we can be another persona there. Then there's the personas we can have offline and off grid.
The best protection anyone can have is just to make the persona that has to use systems unwillingly the least valuable to those trying to extract excess value from it, and reserve our most valuable creations for private systems and places.
Even this conversation would be wildly different on a public platform compared to in a pub.
Going back to Zulip. I don't see video and voice. Same for Rocket.Chat. Hence, for me, this one remains a luxury app to package, when Nextcloud Talk and Element do have those.
Sometimes we don't need every option, just the current best of the best, which I feel we already have.
We'll also never know what data we thought would remain private suddely becomes "training data" for AI LLMs.
Biggest cost in any organisation is change, so its easy for those organisation that have a high change costs for leaving them to just change their Ts & Cs and "feedback" systems to suddenly make it very costly to opt-out of sharing private data with them.
Hence, private self-hosting I see as the digital equivalent of prevention being better than cure for preservation of agency and value.
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@scooke I gave up on that quest a long time ago.
People resist anything they think is effort or unpopular. That's why hyper-scaling capitalism has been so successful and every social media platform a business is expected to be on the ones from the hyper-growth capitalism capital of the tech world.
I see people using WhatsApp and Messenger as no different to people that work production lines to make my devices and clothing. Most just don't want to know any different, as then they'd have to be unsatisfied with their status quo.
It's more valuable for business to keep people believing, and do whatever it takes to retain those "users" (ironic term considering it is also common in describing drug addicts), than it is for them to try lesser-known alternatives, regardless of their superior privacy. So you're competing against an industry of global indoctrination as a business model in that persuasion endeavour.
For me it's:
Nextcloud Talk for all business and organisation ventures.
Signal for my friends and family that care about privacy, although that also has its issues, mainly in lack of ability to export data.
Mattermost + Element I believe has some traction with UK Government using it, and perhaps others, but even I found it confusing to get working at first.
WhatEver for everyone else that's too lazy to care about their own freedom and finds more comfort in giving their value to brands.
It baffles me how many people I care about are addicted to diet sodas, too, but regardless of caring, they just don't see the harm, and worse see anyone's attempts to divert them from such perceived minor vices as an attack on their freedom to choose, even if they know it's a junk brand, it gives them comfort because popularity feels safer than healthy to many.
@marcusquinn said in Zulip - Powerful open source group chat:
lack of ability to export data
https://github.com/carderne/signal-export
AND
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@LoudLemur I think the reality of the modern online world is everyone has multiple personas. There's the systems we use because we have to, and we are one persona there, and the systems we use because we want to, and we can be another persona there. Then there's the personas we can have offline and off grid.
The best protection anyone can have is just to make the persona that has to use systems unwillingly the least valuable to those trying to extract excess value from it, and reserve our most valuable creations for private systems and places.
Even this conversation would be wildly different on a public platform compared to in a pub.
Going back to Zulip. I don't see video and voice. Same for Rocket.Chat. Hence, for me, this one remains a luxury app to package, when Nextcloud Talk and Element do have those.
Sometimes we don't need every option, just the current best of the best, which I feel we already have.
@marcusquinn said in Zulip - Powerful open source group chat:
Going back to Zulip. I don't see video and voice.
Jitsi integration would be fine.
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@marcusquinn said in Zulip - Powerful open source group chat:
Going back to Zulip. I don't see video and voice.
Jitsi integration would be fine.
@robi you got it: https://zulip.com/help/start-a-call
