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  3. OpenLiteSpeed Wordpress

OpenLiteSpeed Wordpress

Scheduled Pinned Locked Moved App Wishlist
wordpressopenlitespeedlitespeed
48 Posts 13 Posters 7.0k Views 16 Watching
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  • M Offline
    M Offline
    mikulabc
    wrote on last edited by
    #21

    What's the status here guys? I came here wanting to use cloudron wp with OLS, anyway we can get this online? 🙂

    girishG 1 Reply Last reply
    1
    • M mikulabc

      What's the status here guys? I came here wanting to use cloudron wp with OLS, anyway we can get this online? 🙂

      girishG Offline
      girishG Offline
      girish
      Staff
      wrote on last edited by
      #22

      @mikulabc Currently, @MooCloud_Matt wants to keep the package exclusive to their customers. Maybe we (cloudron team) will package it for all our customers at some point once we get enough votes for this app.

      ruihildtR 1 Reply Last reply
      1
      • girishG girish

        @mikulabc Currently, @MooCloud_Matt wants to keep the package exclusive to their customers. Maybe we (cloudron team) will package it for all our customers at some point once we get enough votes for this app.

        ruihildtR Offline
        ruihildtR Offline
        ruihildt
        wrote on last edited by
        #23

        I'm a bit disappointed as I don't think this was mentioned in any previous public discussions on the subject.

        @MooCloud_Matt Would you consider sharing your code with the community? I'm not sure anyone here is directly competing with your business to be honest.^^

        1 Reply Last reply
        0
        • marcusquinnM Offline
          marcusquinnM Offline
          marcusquinn
          wrote on last edited by
          #24

          Having been through a of of WP performance testing and comparison in the past, including OLS, I really wouldn't feel your missing out, as we neither managed to get performance as good as standard Nginx & Apache, and it really didn't seem either broadly known by devs or any more than just good default settings that can be done and more with Nginx & Apache anyway.

          Long story short, I don't think anyone is missing out without this as the Cloudron WP stack is already very good, and any performance issues are more than likely with the codebase running on whatever stack, and within that most likely sql query efficiencies in certain plugins that tend to only show themselves slow when you add content.

          First think I recommend everyone should try is disable open_basedir, it was one of the simplest and most impactful changes we made for the least effort.

          We also use a technique similar to that offered with this plugin for only loading what's needed to render each page, before any caching:

          • https://codecanyon.net/item/deactivate-plugins-per-page-improve-wordpress-performance/23801359

          Gonzales or Clearfy Asset Manager does similar things - but like all these things, you need to know or at least bear in mind what you're doing as whenever you unload things you create debugging blindspots:

          • https://wordpress.org/plugins/gonzales/
          • https://clearfy.pro/assets-manager/

          If, after all of that optimisation, you still think OLS is needed, there's no harm in trying other than time but I suspect most will finds that OLS won't help with performance as much as optimising what is asked of the server by the app first.

          Web Design https://www.evergreen.je
          Development https://brandlight.org
          Life https://marcusquinn.com

          MooCloud_MattM 1 Reply Last reply
          1
          • girishG Offline
            girishG Offline
            girish
            Staff
            wrote on last edited by
            #25

            I haven't done extensive testing with OLS, but to add to what @marcusquinn said, the main speed benefits come from caching (which OLS does by default). With WP, if you install WP Super Cache or equivalent, you get very good numbers on Cloudron. It's on my list to investigate integrating Super Cache or something as the default. But these caches always have some corner cases where you have to click the "clear cache" button manually and then we have to inform users about all this. This is why we have left the choice to the user for now.

            marcusquinnM 1 Reply Last reply
            1
            • girishG girish

              I haven't done extensive testing with OLS, but to add to what @marcusquinn said, the main speed benefits come from caching (which OLS does by default). With WP, if you install WP Super Cache or equivalent, you get very good numbers on Cloudron. It's on my list to investigate integrating Super Cache or something as the default. But these caches always have some corner cases where you have to click the "clear cache" button manually and then we have to inform users about all this. This is why we have left the choice to the user for now.

              marcusquinnM Offline
              marcusquinnM Offline
              marcusquinn
              wrote on last edited by
              #26

              @girish Agreed - see caching as more of a problem than a solution, and it usually masks more problems than it solves. Caching is for scaling traffic but full-page caching can't help with dynamic content.

              I can't say we have all the solutions but we have been down the road of trying so many solutions and always come back to the fundamentals that it's the quality of the plugins used and their query efficiency that has the most impact, and we focus on WP Admin speed foremost because that's generally heavier and slower, so if we get that right the front-end is usually fine.

              Web Design https://www.evergreen.je
              Development https://brandlight.org
              Life https://marcusquinn.com

              1 Reply Last reply
              1
              • marcusquinnM marcusquinn

                Having been through a of of WP performance testing and comparison in the past, including OLS, I really wouldn't feel your missing out, as we neither managed to get performance as good as standard Nginx & Apache, and it really didn't seem either broadly known by devs or any more than just good default settings that can be done and more with Nginx & Apache anyway.

                Long story short, I don't think anyone is missing out without this as the Cloudron WP stack is already very good, and any performance issues are more than likely with the codebase running on whatever stack, and within that most likely sql query efficiencies in certain plugins that tend to only show themselves slow when you add content.

                First think I recommend everyone should try is disable open_basedir, it was one of the simplest and most impactful changes we made for the least effort.

                We also use a technique similar to that offered with this plugin for only loading what's needed to render each page, before any caching:

                • https://codecanyon.net/item/deactivate-plugins-per-page-improve-wordpress-performance/23801359

                Gonzales or Clearfy Asset Manager does similar things - but like all these things, you need to know or at least bear in mind what you're doing as whenever you unload things you create debugging blindspots:

                • https://wordpress.org/plugins/gonzales/
                • https://clearfy.pro/assets-manager/

                If, after all of that optimisation, you still think OLS is needed, there's no harm in trying other than time but I suspect most will finds that OLS won't help with performance as much as optimising what is asked of the server by the app first.

                MooCloud_MattM Offline
                MooCloud_MattM Offline
                MooCloud_Matt
                wrote on last edited by
                #27

                @marcusquinn
                Hey Marcus,

                yes and no, OLS/LS is objectively more efficient over apache, and this make it more performant then apache.
                Berceuse as Nginx it can serve static file without wake up a php, that apache is using for every request on a WP.
                But as i already say sometimes a good server lvl optimization of nginx is performing as well but is not easy to setup, OLS or LS offer LSCache to do all the config from WP dashboard.

                WP plugin are not the best way to go, because they just let the call be managed by a PHP, many like Cache enabler, just create a HTML copy of the website, that is more performant no elaboration needed by db or php, but if you use apache you will wake up PHP anyway so CPU and RAM wasted.

                @ruihildt
                We are in Open Beta for OLS, if you want we can provide you the image.
                But for now the code is closed sourse, it will be realise with a custom licenses that is open source but not commercially usable by MSP or ISP to offer WordPress as a Service or PaaS.

                Matteo. R.
                Founder and Tech-Support Manager.
                MooCloud MSP
                Swiss Managed Service Provider

                LonkleL micmcM 2 Replies Last reply
                2
                • MooCloud_MattM MooCloud_Matt

                  @marcusquinn
                  Hey Marcus,

                  yes and no, OLS/LS is objectively more efficient over apache, and this make it more performant then apache.
                  Berceuse as Nginx it can serve static file without wake up a php, that apache is using for every request on a WP.
                  But as i already say sometimes a good server lvl optimization of nginx is performing as well but is not easy to setup, OLS or LS offer LSCache to do all the config from WP dashboard.

                  WP plugin are not the best way to go, because they just let the call be managed by a PHP, many like Cache enabler, just create a HTML copy of the website, that is more performant no elaboration needed by db or php, but if you use apache you will wake up PHP anyway so CPU and RAM wasted.

                  @ruihildt
                  We are in Open Beta for OLS, if you want we can provide you the image.
                  But for now the code is closed sourse, it will be realise with a custom licenses that is open source but not commercially usable by MSP or ISP to offer WordPress as a Service or PaaS.

                  LonkleL Offline
                  LonkleL Offline
                  Lonkle
                  wrote on last edited by Lonkle
                  #28

                  @moocloud_matt I only use Cloudron for personal / development purposes. My production Wordpress installation (hosted elsewhere) uses OLS so it'd be nice to use my Cloudron installation to have the same stack for testing purposes. Would you mind sharing the image with me as well? 🙂

                  MooCloud_MattM 1 Reply Last reply
                  1
                  • LonkleL Lonkle

                    @moocloud_matt I only use Cloudron for personal / development purposes. My production Wordpress installation (hosted elsewhere) uses OLS so it'd be nice to use my Cloudron installation to have the same stack for testing purposes. Would you mind sharing the image with me as well? 🙂

                    MooCloud_MattM Offline
                    MooCloud_MattM Offline
                    MooCloud_Matt
                    wrote on last edited by
                    #29

                    @lonk
                    Yes, ofc!

                    just contact me on the cloudron chat: @MooCloud-Matt.

                    Matteo. R.
                    Founder and Tech-Support Manager.
                    MooCloud MSP
                    Swiss Managed Service Provider

                    1 Reply Last reply
                    0
                    • MooCloud_MattM MooCloud_Matt

                      @marcusquinn
                      Hey Marcus,

                      yes and no, OLS/LS is objectively more efficient over apache, and this make it more performant then apache.
                      Berceuse as Nginx it can serve static file without wake up a php, that apache is using for every request on a WP.
                      But as i already say sometimes a good server lvl optimization of nginx is performing as well but is not easy to setup, OLS or LS offer LSCache to do all the config from WP dashboard.

                      WP plugin are not the best way to go, because they just let the call be managed by a PHP, many like Cache enabler, just create a HTML copy of the website, that is more performant no elaboration needed by db or php, but if you use apache you will wake up PHP anyway so CPU and RAM wasted.

                      @ruihildt
                      We are in Open Beta for OLS, if you want we can provide you the image.
                      But for now the code is closed sourse, it will be realise with a custom licenses that is open source but not commercially usable by MSP or ISP to offer WordPress as a Service or PaaS.

                      micmcM Offline
                      micmcM Offline
                      micmc
                      wrote on last edited by
                      #30

                      @moocloud_matt said in OpenLiteSpeed Wordpress:

                      @ruihildt
                      We are in Open Beta for OLS, if you want we can provide you the image.
                      But for now the code is closed sourse, it will be realise with a custom licenses that is open source but not commercially usable by MSP or ISP to offer WordPress as a Service or PaaS.

                      As far as I know, 'OPENLiteSpeed' is the OPEN version of LiteSpeed server and is licensed under GPL3 which means you cannot take this OPEN SOURCE software, go away with it and close the code for you and your licking.

                      To give an idea this is the preamble that MUST be included in each file's header:

                      <one line to give the program's name and a brief idea of what it does.>
                          Copyright (C) <year>  <name of author>
                      
                          This program is free software: you can redistribute it and/or modify
                          it under the terms of the GNU General Public License as published by
                          the Free Software Foundation, either version 3 of the License, or
                          (at your option) any later version.
                      
                          This program is distributed in the hope that it will be useful,
                          but WITHOUT ANY WARRANTY; without even the implied warranty of
                          MERCHANTABILITY or FITNESS FOR A PARTICULAR PURPOSE.  See the
                          GNU General Public License for more details.
                      
                          You should have received a copy of the GNU General Public License
                          along with this program.  If not, see <https://www.gnu.org/licenses/>.
                      
                      

                      Even before reading the terms of the license, this preamble says it all.

                      I recommend you read carefully the terms of General PUBLIC Licenses 1, 2, and 3 and if you don't understand then ask for legal advice from law people if you do not want to risk to get into hot-water, because in light of what you are saying this is something you cannot do. Jtlyk.

                      Andy

                      Ignorance is not an excuse anymore!
                      https://AutomateKit.com

                      MooCloud_MattM 1 Reply Last reply
                      0
                      • micmcM micmc

                        @moocloud_matt said in OpenLiteSpeed Wordpress:

                        @ruihildt
                        We are in Open Beta for OLS, if you want we can provide you the image.
                        But for now the code is closed sourse, it will be realise with a custom licenses that is open source but not commercially usable by MSP or ISP to offer WordPress as a Service or PaaS.

                        As far as I know, 'OPENLiteSpeed' is the OPEN version of LiteSpeed server and is licensed under GPL3 which means you cannot take this OPEN SOURCE software, go away with it and close the code for you and your licking.

                        To give an idea this is the preamble that MUST be included in each file's header:

                        <one line to give the program's name and a brief idea of what it does.>
                            Copyright (C) <year>  <name of author>
                        
                            This program is free software: you can redistribute it and/or modify
                            it under the terms of the GNU General Public License as published by
                            the Free Software Foundation, either version 3 of the License, or
                            (at your option) any later version.
                        
                            This program is distributed in the hope that it will be useful,
                            but WITHOUT ANY WARRANTY; without even the implied warranty of
                            MERCHANTABILITY or FITNESS FOR A PARTICULAR PURPOSE.  See the
                            GNU General Public License for more details.
                        
                            You should have received a copy of the GNU General Public License
                            along with this program.  If not, see <https://www.gnu.org/licenses/>.
                        
                        

                        Even before reading the terms of the license, this preamble says it all.

                        I recommend you read carefully the terms of General PUBLIC Licenses 1, 2, and 3 and if you don't understand then ask for legal advice from law people if you do not want to risk to get into hot-water, because in light of what you are saying this is something you cannot do. Jtlyk.

                        Andy

                        MooCloud_MattM Offline
                        MooCloud_MattM Offline
                        MooCloud_Matt
                        wrote on last edited by
                        #31

                        @micmc
                        We are not closing OLS, but the other code on the image, that we have written and develop, like the cli interface.

                        Docker image (dockerfile), cloudron.manifest file and the software that they contain can have different license in any case.

                        Matteo. R.
                        Founder and Tech-Support Manager.
                        MooCloud MSP
                        Swiss Managed Service Provider

                        micmcM 1 Reply Last reply
                        1
                        • MooCloud_MattM MooCloud_Matt

                          @micmc
                          We are not closing OLS, but the other code on the image, that we have written and develop, like the cli interface.

                          Docker image (dockerfile), cloudron.manifest file and the software that they contain can have different license in any case.

                          micmcM Offline
                          micmcM Offline
                          micmc
                          wrote on last edited by
                          #32

                          @moocloud_matt said in OpenLiteSpeed Wordpress:

                          @micmc
                          We are not closing OLS,

                          Yet, this is what YOU said/wrote, I can read loll

                          @ruihildt
                          We are in Open Beta for OLS, if you want we can
                          provide you the image.
                          But >>for now the code is closed sourse<<

                          Cheers!
                          Andy

                          Ignorance is not an excuse anymore!
                          https://AutomateKit.com

                          MooCloud_MattM 1 Reply Last reply
                          0
                          • micmcM micmc

                            @moocloud_matt said in OpenLiteSpeed Wordpress:

                            @micmc
                            We are not closing OLS,

                            Yet, this is what YOU said/wrote, I can read loll

                            @ruihildt
                            We are in Open Beta for OLS, if you want we can
                            provide you the image.
                            But >>for now the code is closed sourse<<

                            Cheers!
                            Andy

                            MooCloud_MattM Offline
                            MooCloud_MattM Offline
                            MooCloud_Matt
                            wrote on last edited by MooCloud_Matt
                            #33

                            @micmc
                            Is been always the same, we previously have use OLS as moocloud app of OLS that use a custom image that include proprietary code.
                            That allow us to choose the license for our image.
                            OLS and the other software inside will maintain there license as usual.

                            Our license will not interfere with any cloudron customer but only with MSP or Hosting providers, if you are one of those 2 you can contact moocloud and we can have an agreement.

                            Matteo. R.
                            Founder and Tech-Support Manager.
                            MooCloud MSP
                            Swiss Managed Service Provider

                            1 Reply Last reply
                            0
                            • K Offline
                              K Offline
                              kris
                              wrote on last edited by
                              #34

                              Hello
                              Has the project been abandoned? If not, when can we expect to see WordPress in the OLS environment

                              MooCloud_MattM 1 Reply Last reply
                              0
                              • K kris

                                Hello
                                Has the project been abandoned? If not, when can we expect to see WordPress in the OLS environment

                                MooCloud_MattM Offline
                                MooCloud_MattM Offline
                                MooCloud_Matt
                                wrote on last edited by
                                #35

                                @kris
                                hello @kris,

                                for now, all the apps developed by us are not on the store, we are talking with the Cloudron team about how partners can publish apps.

                                It will take some time anyway, but the Nginx version of WordPress will probably be the first app from us on the store.

                                Matteo. R.
                                Founder and Tech-Support Manager.
                                MooCloud MSP
                                Swiss Managed Service Provider

                                1 Reply Last reply
                                2
                                • J Offline
                                  J Offline
                                  jonashartmann
                                  wrote on last edited by
                                  #36

                                  please - this would be THE APP OF THE YEAR!! I would use cloudron for my 200 hosting clients if this would be possible with open lite speed.

                                  marcusquinnM MooCloud_MattM 2 Replies Last reply
                                  0
                                  • J jonashartmann

                                    please - this would be THE APP OF THE YEAR!! I would use cloudron for my 200 hosting clients if this would be possible with open lite speed.

                                    marcusquinnM Offline
                                    marcusquinnM Offline
                                    marcusquinn
                                    wrote on last edited by marcusquinn
                                    #37

                                    @jonashartmann We found we could get Wordpress running pretty efficiently with some techniques detailed by Dave Hilditch here:

                                    • https://www.wpintense.com

                                    As an example, there's over 100 plugins on our Wordpress & Woocommerce site here hosted on a Cloudron app:

                                    • https://brandlight.org
                                    • https://brandlight.org/the-pursuit-of-website-speed-is-almost-over-when-you-have-perceptibly-instant-page-loading-times-everywhere/
                                    • (Since that was written, we reproduced what Algolia does with an in-house developed ElasticSearch alternative, also hosted on Cloudron.)

                                    Web Design https://www.evergreen.je
                                    Development https://brandlight.org
                                    Life https://marcusquinn.com

                                    robiR humptydumptyH 2 Replies Last reply
                                    0
                                    • J jonashartmann

                                      please - this would be THE APP OF THE YEAR!! I would use cloudron for my 200 hosting clients if this would be possible with open lite speed.

                                      MooCloud_MattM Offline
                                      MooCloud_MattM Offline
                                      MooCloud_Matt
                                      wrote on last edited by
                                      #38

                                      @jonashartmann
                                      The first MooCloud App that will be ported is WordPress + Nginx (that in many cases is even better than OLS), but we have OLS already working for many of our servers with cloudron.
                                      It is just a question of porting it and publishing it.

                                      We are working with cloudron to allow MooCloud Registry and apps to the AppStore but it is too early to promise any ETA.

                                      Matteo. R.
                                      Founder and Tech-Support Manager.
                                      MooCloud MSP
                                      Swiss Managed Service Provider

                                      1 Reply Last reply
                                      0
                                      • marcusquinnM marcusquinn

                                        @jonashartmann We found we could get Wordpress running pretty efficiently with some techniques detailed by Dave Hilditch here:

                                        • https://www.wpintense.com

                                        As an example, there's over 100 plugins on our Wordpress & Woocommerce site here hosted on a Cloudron app:

                                        • https://brandlight.org
                                        • https://brandlight.org/the-pursuit-of-website-speed-is-almost-over-when-you-have-perceptibly-instant-page-loading-times-everywhere/
                                        • (Since that was written, we reproduced what Algolia does with an in-house developed ElasticSearch alternative, also hosted on Cloudron.)
                                        robiR Offline
                                        robiR Offline
                                        robi
                                        wrote on last edited by
                                        #39

                                        @marcusquinn said in OpenLiteSpeed Wordpress:

                                        (Since that was written, we reproduced what Algolia does with an in-house developed ElasticSearch alternative, also hosted on Cloudron.)

                                        Is there a how-to on that?

                                        Conscious tech

                                        MooCloud_MattM marcusquinnM 2 Replies Last reply
                                        0
                                        • robiR robi

                                          @marcusquinn said in OpenLiteSpeed Wordpress:

                                          (Since that was written, we reproduced what Algolia does with an in-house developed ElasticSearch alternative, also hosted on Cloudron.)

                                          Is there a how-to on that?

                                          MooCloud_MattM Offline
                                          MooCloud_MattM Offline
                                          MooCloud_Matt
                                          wrote on last edited by
                                          #40

                                          @robi said in OpenLiteSpeed Wordpress:

                                          Is there a how-to on that?

                                          Most likely yes.
                                          And mostly is custom develop.

                                          I think that we should be able to offer solution that are a good, not perfect, but fit for everyone.

                                          Matteo. R.
                                          Founder and Tech-Support Manager.
                                          MooCloud MSP
                                          Swiss Managed Service Provider

                                          1 Reply Last reply
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