Cloudron Forum

@joseph Completed the migration to the new server, but I ran into several errors restoring apps. Roughly 70% of the apps were in an error state, with a message similar to this one for Listmonk: Docker Error: Unable to pull image cloudron/app.listmonk.cloudronapp:202411131609490000. Please check the network or if the image needs authentication. statusCode: 500

The event log shows a successful attempt to restore again: App was restored from version 1.9.0 to version 1.9.0 using backup at 2024-12-14-150347-189/app_

but multiple attempts at this have failed. In all but two apps (Listmonk and Mail), retrying (with an occasional app restart) has gotten this to work for each app. Services have plenty of resources. The server is large. I am unable to try Recovery Mode for this app as the error state locks me out of that option (and the restarting option as well). (Rebooted the server. Mail restored next time, but ListMonk took ~ 2 more times to work)

Two One questions:

(1) How can I resolve this?

(2) - Why did this happen in the first place?

I followed the backup, restore, dry run, sync DNS, update certificates process and all seemed to work fine.

@humptydumpty Thanks for saving me some testing time.

What if you configured other domains to send mail via an SMTP service like Postmark? Probably the server IP address would leak, but perhaps not the domain.

@nebulon Could the groups ACL currently built into Cloudron be extended into SoGo calendar? It is possible to limit apps to certain groups. Can multiple Sogo instances be added so that Group X has access to its own Sogo and Group Y has access to its own Sogo and the address book while global is confined to just the group?

@humptydumpty Nothing more difficult than getting family to accept your help and acknowledge that perhaps you know something that they don't:) To your point, perhaps during signup a warning about mail delivery to these inbox providers and a suggestion to use another email address. Caveat emptor.

@nebulon Thank you for the explanation. Is there any way to implement a "company directory" by domain as opposed to a "Cloudron directory"? Clearly this method would not work since all CLoudron users would be exposed and their calendar availability as well(:

@guyds Thank you for posting your test results. I am wondering if email addresses from certain domains should be "blocked" by software developers for account registration. If a user tried to sign up using {hotmail, live, outlook, Yahoo? AOL? etc?} then registration is rejected with a message: "due to unreliable delivery practices at these domains, we can not accept your registration since we can not properly service you. Please choose another inbox provider and we will gladly accept your registraion"

@nebulon Thank you posting this information. If you enable the Cloudron user directory, is it all users on that Cloudron or only the users defined for that domain? For example, if I have 10 users on mail.domain1.com and 10 users on mail.domain2.com, will every user see 20 users or just the 10 resident in their domain?

@ joseph Thank you. I will try this process. @jdaviescoates Much appreciated tip about "dry run". I will combine your collective wisdom and go forth and conquer!

@ joseph I think I've got it. In checking my DNS, all of my domains are managed at Porkbun, one of the integrated domain/DNS providers. Does that mean that upon restoring the backup, the new Cloudron will detect the change in IP address of the server and request updates @ Porkbun using the API credentials enrolled in my Cloudron?

@joseph Interesting. Hadn't considered that. Can you please provide a link to the recommended procedure? Would I start by adding another Cloudron to my account (say a free version), restore the backup, and then move the paid license to the newly created Cloudron?

@joseph Yes. My appsdata and boxdata folders are symlinked to the external mount point. If you could help provide the correct sequence of commands to stop the Cloudron, copy the folders back to the default location, and restart the Cloudron, I would be very grateful. I get the general idea of what is needed, but I don't want to make a mistake and break my installation. Of course the first step is an extra complete backup!

@joseph Any advice on how to move the core Cloudron data folders back to the main mounted drive? I need to move my Cloudron to a different host.

@d19dotca Interesting. Do you think this might happen even if you were using Mailgun 100% of the time? Did one of your users misbehave and that's why they blocked your IP? I was operating under the assumption that "pay to play" with a large SMTP service would avoid all this hassle. And to avoid unhappy users I was willing to incur the added cost. But perhaps my logic is flawed. Under those circumstances it might be wise to have multiple SMTP paths, with a simple dropdown to select {Cloudron Native, Mailgun, Postmark, etc.} Then we can all go on vacation!

@girish We contributed some code back to Plausible Analytics some time ago to accomplish some things we wanted on our time line rather than theirs. They publish infrequent "official" updates to the self-hosted Docker code in part to minimize the support impact on their small development team. I believe they publish their code (not self-hosted) updates more frequently, which might give visibility to security updates and new features. Their primary source of revenue is from paid accounts that they host on their own infrastructure, so perhaps another reason is to entice customers to use their hosted Plausible solution.

FWIW, we do both, in part to support their efforts. They are solid and I have nothing but good things to say about them as a company, a platform, and as individuals.

@humptydumpty Interesting suggestions. I am thinking that we don't understand the long-term implications of adding an app to the Cloudron App store. App packaging is the first "investment" required, but who will monitor new releases? Once a release is issued, who will adapt it again?

There are various different ways the community can help. App packaging is a good one. Money is another. It is also possible that the Cloudron team is happy with the way things are going and growing is not something they can (or wish to do) at this point in time. I for one am trying to be patient while they figure this out. They have a community willing to help. And when they are ready, they will remind us of all our offers of time, money and chocolate chip cookies to get the job done.

With respect to WP/Woo, right now the WordPress ecosystem is a nightmare. With WordPress.org and WPEngine at each others' throats, the community is really suffering. My company is sitting on the sidelines and waiting for all of this to sort out.

FWIW, we have used Shopify for eCommerce and it works well. It is not open source and requires a monthly subscription. You might also want to look at Stripe. They have many tools that might allow you to make your website eCommerce-ready at a simple level. While not open source, they are essentially free (you just pay for CC processing). We just helped a client add tshirts to their website using only a payment link as an integration point. Stripe handled the cart process, address, even size (S/M/L/XL). Even major corporations are using Stripe for their superior card acceptance processes.

In the spirit of being grateful for what we have (U.S. Thanksgiving holiday), I would like to reconsider my previous post about the lack of new business applications and the App Wishlist in general.

The Cloudron team does an amazing job with their limited resources and after going through a well-documented, flawless upgrade to Ubuntu 24.04 on two Cloudrons, I am appreciating the quality of what we have. So while wanting more of a good thing is an easy trap to fall into, creating and sustaining a good thing is not.

So I will trust in the team that has delivered for us time after time and will be delighted by App Wish list surprises when they appear.

@NCKNE Sorry to share this bad news but we are seeing the same (delayed delivery) behavior using another (not Cloudron, not self-hosted) SMTP service (Postmark). So far it just seems to be just Yahoo and AOL for us. But I'm not sure this idea would work given how inbox providers are treating email even from large SMTP services like Cloudron. These emails are categorized as "broadcast" messages based on the "same message to many" criteria, but are informing customers of important changes. We are not marketing anything at all.

@joseph Apologies for the confusion. My mistake. It was not the backups (which are already mapped to a S3-compatible service) but rather the disk where critical Cloudron data was stored. I was using a drive mapped to a Hetzner volume. Here is a screenshot:

What are the proper steps to move these folders back to the root folder (/) on the main disk (/dev/sda1)?

The new server I am migrating to will have a much larger disk and no external volume.

@girish In preparation to move my Cloudron from Hetzner (where I have a mounted volume for backup) to another provider, it seems as if the proper change beforehand is to follow your guidance above: "switch to Filesystem and put the path as /var/backups (this is also the default after you install cloudron)". Is this correct?